Type: Posts; User: Boquise
Hi there. My smol community is on the road to get a revival after almost getting extinct. Thanks to @Askthepizzaguy we have got a shot to get back on track. However we are few. So we need your help tbh!
MM is a sorta old community that has a long tradition of players and games that love funny flavour and funny roles. Back in our haydays we had MVP awards for every game and also a Hall of Fame. We have fostered several excellent players despite always being comparably small to other communities. Just take a look at our Mafia Championship CV. The best way to describe the MM community is that it is a close-knit family however.
This is the game we currently have in sign-ups.
It is an 11er with power roles (and 4 vanilla town).
How is it like playing a game on MM?
- Games are slower due to people not posting as much. There is no post restriction, but only a few people post "a lot" (and on MU standards, that is not a high poster). Thus MM is the perfect place for people who enjoy chill low-posting games. We have had issues with activity (which is why I am here trying to recruit new blood).
- It is a friendly community. I don't remember the last time someone got banned. I think the last perma ban happened before I joined the site even (and I joined in 2013). There have been a handful of games that got heated, but not on a level that resulted in a ban. Thus, MM games are nice to play if you enjoy friendly games with almost no toxicity.
- We put emphasis on PRs. Previously, every person was a PR. We are walking back on that with this game however for balance reason but also for accessibility. The idea was that people feel more invested when they have a role. Due to this, a handful of us are not used to this style of mafia that everyone in the world but us have played. But we are learning. We have called our version of mafia as "Den mafia". Here is a guide to it. Aside from the first item, everything else is pretty much still in play.
- Game thread does not close during night. This means that every alive player can post during Night in the thread. This is workable due to the low-intensivity of our games.
- We really like stories. Flavour is an important part of our games and is directly tied with what has happened during the day/night (with no TMI). Every role is a character with a brief backstory. Thus, if you like playing mafia games with story, this is a good site for you. Due to our low amount of games, you will easily be able to host a game with your flavour here too if we get more people to play.
- Our domain died so we are on jcink and pray to God that we will not perish. Jcink is kinda wonky to play on, but it works. Here is a guide to make the site a little better tbh
So to sum this up. If you enjoy playing lowkey games with lowkey people, this is something for you. If you want to help revive a renowned mafia site and maybe even make a name of yourself in forum mafia, this is also a site for you tbh. If you enjoy flavour and/or PR games, this is a site for you tbqh.
Hope to see future Maniacs!
Thanks for reading tbqh!
Wow I am a minesweeper pro tbh
A triumph tbh!
Please let me leave the pocket now i promise i will be good
Well deserved tbh
nice congrats tbh
thanks for the votes tbh
Grats Gorf tbh
obligatory frozen Lissa meme
grats wiml tbh
Pretty decisive victory tbh
It is the final showdown tbh, cat vs cat tbh
ofc i broke the spoiler...
Some people really enjoyed my custom made memes this game so I am going to post a compilation tbh
first non ygo cards
wow nutella goat tbh
popcorn kernel master
also I see that I am barely staying alive three challenges in a row
First, I want to say that I am not mad at anyone but myself.
Secondly, I want to thank you all for all the kind words, encouragements and hype, in both spec and in the thread. I cant process it or feel that way, but I appreciate it and it makes me smile.
I am going to address several things that I want to talk about. Some of it is emotion. Emotion I locked outside of the thread after my crash and burn D1-D2. I am going to end this essay (tho lol it wont look as funny as my town case and stuff) with my final meme of Mafia Championship as a player, considering this is the last one I will ever play (due to not having a site to rep anymore, and because I have played so many times so I should step down in favour of others). It is a bittersweet feeling because I love the championship and I love playing to entertain.
Before all that, I will reveal my two last ygo cards, made for either loss or win (at least vote correctly).
In Sweden, we usually give a box of chocolate as a gift when being guests. There are some tasty chocolates in it but also a few disgusting ones. These spoiler boxes mirror this.
Section 1 - Self-Meta AtE the game
To be clear, I don't dislike them per se, but I think there is excessive self-meta and AtE.
Let us start with self-meta.
The issue with self-meta is that it makes the game go stuck. If someone wolf reads you, you can obviously say that you wouldnt do that as scum. That is normal. But what I dislike with self-meta is when the defender go ballistic with it. Like, you are not allowed to have that read because that goes against my self-meta and if you dont do as I say I will wolf read you.
Or, you make a case on somebody and someone else quotes portions of it and say "nah X doesnt do that as a wolf".
This stumps solving. Because even if you are right, you are making the other person unable to play to their fullest. Even in a wrong solve, a player can appear both townie/scum. These things create discussion topics and well... it is a part of the game.
AtE. I think regular AtE is alright. Like, being frustrated in the thread. Calling out to the void. I dislike AtE when it is excessive. I dislike feeling uncomfortable pushing people because they will scream and cry and stuff. I know thats on me, because emotional play is legit. I just really dont vibe with it. It is a playstyle I tend to avoid and that I dont enjoy interacting with. And it is also hard to counter, as both alignments. Like if I ignore this I might hurt that person and that sucks. Bleh.
Why I think self-meta and AtE have a place is because they are a part of the three bases of rhetoric: ethos and pathos. But doing em in excess is just not fun for anyone. Like my only option to combat it is to just ignore the AtE and push anyway.
Emotionally, I do think it is worse when wolves AtE (at least when it is fake). I understand why some wolves feel like they have to though. But to me it feels manipulative in bad way and that has more to do with my own irl experiences, and like I said, it depends on the AtE.
I am happy that I have not felt any need to do excessive AtE as a wolf on MU and have still won all my wolf games (except one turbo smh).
My D5 strategy and how it fell into pieces
During around mid-D5 I got to Kat/Alexa and devised a plan. It was at an all-time low in the thread where everyone were just $%#!ting on the game and spec chat. And when I got to Kat/Alexa, I felt a sense of tranquility. Like. Everything made sense. Thunal and Wiml were obviously town. It is Kat and Alexa. I felt at peace. I "knew" that Alexa was a wolf, and was pretty sure Kat was too. Due to how they interacted with each other, like how Kat really did not want to interact with suggestions to shoot Alexa and how Alexa began AtEing about that. I also felt like at least one of the AtEs must be written because of being under a sort of obligation to write it.
I had earlier scum cased Kat for Vandy TMI and was walking back to it. And when Katze wrote, after I said I wanted to vote, that they will vote before I did and vote Thunal, I felt even more sure that Alexa and Kat were scum together.
Still, I wasnt 100% sure on Katze as scum. I think they wrote some townie sounding posts still. But I wanted that Alexa vote. I waited for Wiml to write a post. To stall time, because I was so scared of doing it. I was hesitating yet again and that annoyed me. I took deep breaths after Wiml posted. And was about to vote, when I saw the thread update and Katze had voted. I was so annoyed at myself.
But here I hatched a plan. One of Thunal/Katze is scum and I was really sure Alexa was scum too and I really wanted to avoid a tinfoil F3. I wanted to nail down both scum in one phase. So I decide to just observe what Alexa does, who she is pushing and who she isn't. I feel pretty confident on Alexa/Katze (though my mind keeps looping about how I wanted to vote Alexa so I am also not that happy anymore even though I am trying to wim it up). I even telegraph it through mafia host.
What went wrong then?
Well for one, I did not hold my cards close enough since I was so excited about having a 95% wolf read. But still I was passive, and when looking at how everyonme else was posting, I felt that Alexa and Thunal were teamed more than Katze which made me have to change my case post's contents since I was originally going to write about Katze, not Thunal. I did a reaction test as well, and both swept in to defend each other. I thought that wolves would be aiming for a F5 right here and then. And like, I am usually wrong on things and Katze "sounds" townie so like yeah this is the way.
I feel like this strategy was not too dumb or anything. I did consider the worlds where Alexa votes her partner for wifom and cred. But the solid pairing with Thunal/Alexa made me think that was the likelier scenario. Hats off to them. I really regret not voting. Really regret not being able to be assertive.
And idk, instead of trying to be fancy, I should have just voted Katze right away and deal with an annoying F3.
My final showdown
So for the first 30-45 minutes of the Night, I still think it is Alexa, then slightly flip to Thunal. I am laughing at how Katze fooled me and that I lost the wifom game to Alexa. I laughed because in a cosmic sense it is funny that this is how my championship saga ends. It also hurt a lot, but I will go into that later.
As sod came closer, I wasnt too sure on Alexa being the one. Because "why would she play like that then?" This is btw a stupid line of thought, because had she voted Thunal, there is always the risk that I or someone else votes Katze in return. Like my strat was to vote where she did not. Yet thats how I thought. I enter sod and have a pretty open mind. I want to start solving right away and not interact with the thread too much. I expect the two of them to not believe anything I would be saying, but this was about me getting things right. I wanted that correct vote.
I ask Alexa about the wifom comment (since it worried me) and I get a bit annoyed at her first ignoring answering my question.
I ask Thunal about the lying.
Either way, Alexa wants to give me time and Thunal kinda starts shading me quickly. I get frustrated again at Alexa for wanting me to towncase myself instead of solving. I am still leaning to Thunal wolf still though.
There were moments I walked back on Alexa being town. That is those times I say “the townie in you”. I did go “hmm” when Alexa got mad at me just joking about her being scum, right before when I slept tho. Either way, I don’t think I could have pulled this over no matter how I played due to my misplay in F5.
I am sad that I was yeeted after I went to bed. I wanted to look at other stuff, like I planned to read both Thunal and Alexa through sections of the whole game. I think 8 times out of 10 I still think it is Thunal, but since I was beginning to walk back, it would have been nice to just vote correctly.
Anyway. Despite all that, another reason I did not vote early during this day was because I did not want the game to end. Selfish yeah but like. It was my last Champ Day. I wanted to make the most of it and I had fun most of the time (leaving the despair for the previous night and post game). It was fun town casing myself and stuff.
We don't serve redemption arcs in this timeline, sir
This contains emotion. Like, meandering emotions where I am a whiny little brat. It is an explosion of all the emotions I held in during this game. I need to get it out of my system. It is very cringe.
I do not know where to start. I really do not. In a way I feel sad, in a way I feel just… nothing? I did keep my larger emotions at bay after D1. Such as how I felt after Gorf yeet, Pilica yeet and Katze yeet.
It was not really the plan to play this season. Season 7 had been horrible, and I am just not saying that “cos”. It was horrible. I wanted to quit playing mafia after G9. But I love champs. And so I did my fifth season.
The one thing I have hated the most with my town play is my inability to be assertive with reads. I don’t form reads that are “strong” in the sense that I can explain them logically. They are mostly vibes and poe. So it is hard to be assertive. And it was my goal to change that.
I have been aware of Champs since S1 when my home community sent people off. It looked grand and scary and I wanted in. Though at that time I did not feel ready. Coolkid went S2 and won the whole shebang. I loved it. And I wanted it too (he was sorta my rival sometimes). I subbed in S3 and did horribly, then I just kept going. It became my dream to win it. S8 was my final chance imo. And I blew it myself.
I have been the misyeet in a champ F3 three times now. People meme about me being cursed and that that's how F3s are supposed to be when I am town. I get those are jokes, and I am not offended, but it hurts. It stings.
So we have the S8 Finale. And it starts like my other high stakes games that I remember, and I kinda PTSD out of frustration on myself. I recover. I am in F5, and I suddenly have the solve. I feel tranquil. Everything is in my hands. All I need to do is vote. And I don’t do it in time. Because I am not assertive. I closed my eyes and breathed. I knew I was correct, yet I didn't do it. I completely single-handedly destroyed my own dream by failing to do what I had decided that I needed to do. Be assertive.
And not only that. On D4 I was so close to voting both Katze and Alexa due to a feeling I had with their posts (Katze’s deflation; Alexa’s attempt to bury me), I did not. And I felt so angry and frustrated at myself during that Night. I could hardly sleep. Then starting D5 and it is soldiering on like usual. I walked back from my eod4 feels and tried to just… play without showing how much everything sucked. And then I do the exact same thing in eod5. Fail at being assertive. This time it is on Wiml, and well he was town so ultimately that’s good, but I am still frustrated. Didn’t I learn anything from eod4??? I hardly slept that night as well. Between D4 and D5 I think I had slept for like 2-3 hours for each irl night. I dont want to go into what exactly I felt, but I felt a lot. Still, it was not over. Just play and vibe. I had a fun time in the thread and I DID like the challenge despite being so angry at myself that I didnt know what to do.
And then it is F5. And I have the ball, I have an open goal, and I miss.
When I saw Katze’s flip I was silent for a few seconds. Blinking. Then I laughed. First I laughed in disbelief, then in resignation. I had been outplayed, that is cool. Then I remembered eod4. Then it sank in. I will die in F3. Again. I will lose. Again. Had I only voted like I was meant to, this would not have happened. The whole loss is on me. And in a cosmic sense it is hilarious. Like of course this is how my championship career ends. Of course this is how the whole thing ends. I’m just a meme. Why did I even try. I went to bed and closed my eyes but couldn’t sleep. My brain is a nasty thing that likes looping thoughts excessively and it bombarded me. It played up my misplays, it repeated lines, it reminded me of all my $%#! ups in S3, S4, S5 and S7. I have lost it all. I slept for around 90 minutes that night. 90 minutes of sleep and 5,5 hours of thoughts. I went to work the next day. And all I could think of was what would come when the clock hits midnight my time. And it is all my fault.
Still, I wanted to do the game justice and I wanted to give it my all, no excuses, during that F3. Never give up. The least thing I could do to my teammates and myself is to play. I was kinda dead inside during the first hours though but then I got into the groove again.
I knew I would lose. I had accepted it already.
That does not make the F5 easier. Imagine that you have practiced for something for five years. You lost a Finale already spectacularly and just misplayed the $%#! out of it. That memory has lived on vividly for years, and now you have the opportunity to correct everything. To make that vote. And you $%#!ing do the same mistake again. This was my best shot, my one shot. And I blew it and I will not be able to forgive myself for that. Mafia is just a game and there is more to life, yes. But this was my moment. Except it was not. I want/wanted to scream at everything how unfair it is even though I fell on my own grip. This was my one chance. Right now things feel pointless. So what if I am assertive in another game? It is not the finale. Too little, too late. I can’t feel proud of my game this time around when I utterly failed.
I really wanted that redemption arc. I yearned for it.
But that is not how things work. Because I misplayed. It is all on me. Factually.
$%#! man. This is how it ends, huh.
I feel this much about this because I care so much about champs and I just… want to feel happy with my play. Do something right for once when things outside of mafia don't.
Actually, no more words. This is my favourite scene in my favourite Disney movie, featuring my favourite MC (who was my childhood relate-to-hero) and my favourite villain.
It explains it better than I could ever do, though I have not had a Silver. It just. Jim’s words echoes all my thoughts and emotions on the whole thing. It just fits and has always fit.
Why does it have to end like this? I don’t want it to. I want to keep champing smh.
I have super special rare cards tbh
This contains positive cringe tbh
This loss does hurt, and it is true I won’t forgive myself for this, ever. That does not take away that I love the championship. I love the aspect of spec chat and entertaining them. People I have not talked to say that they read games I play because I am always fun to watch. I feel a little bad for hardly interacting back. It just feels really nice. People who have seen me play champs for years and get happy to see me and my memes and my posts. And I play my heart out and that creates a sort of drama that makes people laugh and care and that is some powerful stuff. That makes everything worth it. That makes this loss worth it. I have vanity searched me after this game, and I see familiar faces and some not. Some I talk to on a regular basis, some I have never spoken to. And my posts have given them excitement and laughter over the years. I am humbled and thankful for that.
I love champs. I love the competition. I enjoy vibing and memeing in the thread and not being too serious about it, even though I end up doing that anyway. Because I care about the competition. I hatched my idea of doing ygo card memes a bit before rand. I wanted to make a tribute to the competition that has been a huge part of my life from when I was 22 to now when I am 27. All the funny memes and the players, known and unknown (like I $%#!ing love you Jseadog, you are the man). Now it is over for me. I seriously do not think I will play a champ game again. I don’t want to occupy a spot for someone who hasn’t got to do it yet. So I wanted to pay tribute.
Which is also why I wanted to pay tribute to SK in that meme video. A saga that came to an end. A story that I have been very invested in.
I love champs! I remember how Speck said he played the whole qualifier on his 3DS. That was insane. I remember Newcomb’s funny meme response to fdas. I remember how I death tunnelled Stanari and made some weirdo metaphor, like, walking inside thorny bushes to read her or something. Then in post-game people in her community said they loved me. ??? Poor Stan. Stanari is a delight. I remember always having a fun time playing with the Flight Rising community. How Tsaiah wrote on my MU wall to congratulate me on my S4G11 win. It is still there and the words still make me happy. Tsaiah, a person who I have hardly played/interacted with, whom I saw in spec chat just… getting my playstyle and being entertained. Speaking of FlightRising, Trash and Abyssum too, it is always fun to play with the FR gang.
I remember how Tigger made me go insane. I was working a summer job during that game (for my dad, picking weeds) and I sneakily spied on my phone what Tigger was saying during that lylo. Even read his upside down text smfh. I remember my scum team, Helios and Alohomora. Two great players. It saddened me that I was the only one to advance and I hope they are doing okay. We had a great and fun scum chat.
I remember how I was in a car ride during the Wild Card reveal. And G11 was revealed like last. I was in complete excitement. What if I would advance? And I did. I advanced. It was such an incredible feeling. Some jury people had looked at my game and decided that I should get another game. Never been happier for a game. For a sport. I dont know why they advanced me still, but it made me so happy. I was not used to getting recognised. It was a new and strange feeling.
I remember the bond I formed with SK through the wild card game, even though it ended in tragedy. I remember having a really fun time playing with TomKat, and how I found scum at D1!!!! (walked back because I wanted to give the sub another day smfh). I remember how 113 wrote Et tu Brute? when waiting for me to hammer him. How his reaction to the players alive were “Man I even had to check my own role pm because i thought I was scum for a second” (he was town lol). I remember how dlgn got all conspiracy with me because I posted a gif of Edgar Allan Poe and remade a Poe poem as a list. Even asked me about previous games on his homesite, if I had read them.
I remember how hard I fought in S5G8 quali when I subbed in as scum. How TK and I had a Swede moment. The strategies Shakespeare told me about. How we almost lost to some extremely good late sub ins like Orange and Squirtle. How Eevee outplayed us with a fake claim. How I made the final vote when it was 1 second left.
I remember witnessing the epic showdown between Slaan, M Plus (Tangrowth) versus Five in their semifinal. That is one of the only times I have been 100% invested in a game I was not playing myself. What a show. What excitement. Do it again!
I remember the finale. How Paratroopa and I bonded for being the leftover townies. I remember the hype. Especially the day we almost got Empoof yeeted. I remember the DS posts that made me laugh. I remember GH’s “oh $%#! i am so scared” at an eod and Nego voted for him and I was like “yeh, man, i should too” but did not because I am not a big boy.
I have already spoken about Abyssum but I want to say I remember her again. A great friend who talked to me during some really bad irl things. She is awesome.
I remember enjoying watching the games of S6, though I did not have much time due to uni. Dobby’s panic about 1610. The whole shebang of that game. And to think I would meet that goofball irl. I remember Jseadog and his quote. Fantastic stuff. I remember watching G11 and enjoying it as a cute lowkey game where Pokechu bussed the $%#! out of his teammates and I remember chess24 playing a lowkey cool scum game.
I remember AvatarVecna, whose anger I completely understood. They were the fresh air that said the things I did not dare to say and though certain things were out of the line, I am grateful to have had them on their side. They made that game tolerable. Also Penguin. Penguin did make that game enjoyable. What a great scum player to play against.
I remember how JJJ talked me through SF3. How he told people to give me peace and just… talk me through my despair. I really really really appreciated that helping hand. Thank you so much. Post 4041 and 4239 specifically.
I remember my qualifier this season (lol of course I do). I got a good friend in Chingles! And Jeremy played like a $%#!ing goat. He set himself up to be my yearly death tunneller, and walked it back, but also walked back his tunnel on Capage. He is an extraordinary player and I hope to see him play again. I remember how Capage and I, after years of strife in games, found each other. And towned together. It felt so good to lean back and feel like we were town in sync. That was a blast. And watching Skunki fight was, although I had a bias, entertaining and fun. I remember the excitement in SF1. Soneji finding Silver. That was awesome. Me reuniting with Gorf since S3 and after some hurdles, I was able to comfortably town read him. Beaker! was a great player to play with, despite my sus of him. Being able to town read both Chingles and Ap were a great time too, and the vote a wolf meme. PRing with Thunal felt nice, like, it felt good to bounce ideas with her and be able to relate to each other with our clear town fears.
Basically. I love champs. I have been playing as this underdog. The one who keeps trying but falls at the end. But I have also had fun, and I think I have been more than a clown underdog? I always vanity search myself and I kinda get like “wow, did my post make you feel like that?” “oh damn i didnt think about that” “yessss like my memes plssss” and just been in awe and humbled of the excitement that I have helped create (pls be kind to players tho). The whole entertaining people part is what I love the most. When I advanced to the finale, my ultimate goal, regardless of dreams, was to have fun.
I had fun. Thank you for playing with me and watching me during these years. Thank you for your kind words, for your cheers, for you being sad on my behalf, for caring about my little story. Thank you. Thank you for playing with me, keeping up with me despite the fact that I am demanding and can be annoying. I’d love to play again in champs, but I don’t think that will happen. Thank you and goodbye.
I am sending myself off with this final meme.
The final championship meme from Player Boquise
Beware, some Rick and Morty season 5 finale spoilers are in it tbh
I will answer people individually later but thanks for the kind words. I just can't take in positive/encouraging words right now.
I was super close to vote Katze at D4.
I had the correct solve at D6.
Then I hesitated again.
Today I did begin to tinfoil Alexa once more but stopped.
$%#!ing sucks. $%#!. $%#!. $%#!. $%#!. Insert all the AtE I held in. Like after the Gorf yeet, that night, idk how to describe how disappointed I was in myself. Then the Pilica yeet. Then when Katze was yeeted I thought I had ruined everything for town. Again, in a worse way than S5 Finale.
Nice to single-handedly throw because I am too scared to make votes when they count.
To think that had I not hesitated, I would have crossed with Alexa yesterday.
I very little knowledge of you and wiml's relationship prior to this game. The point is the emotional connection created in this specific game.
Yes, it is what -I- think here that matters on the NK. My mindset. It doesn't matter if you doubt that I'd win Wiml over, or what theoretical perspective you have there. I personally think that I would have a higher chance to live in any F3 that isn't this.
Back to other reasons to clear me
Like I said, if I am a wolf, you will have to believe that I, out of nowhere when I am alone in the thread, start solving Vandy (actually it isn't even out of nowhere, I react to a post about Vandy by saying hmm and decide to inspect his read list) and put in a good amount of time and effort to then start sussing Kat. To end up right after to town read Kat. That doesn't make sense.
Another thing that doesn't make sense if Kat and I are scum is eod4. Katze unvotes me, leaving me at 2 versus 3 on Gorf, and people have said they prefer me over Gorf. Meanwhile, I am sussing a Kat post a little, go back on it, and then just sit there frozen and then vote Gorf in the last second.
That is disorganised. That is a Scooby Doo villain team, me and Katze just sitting there screaming as town is doing everything. That is not a team that came all the way to F5.
Katze would not unvote Gorf there (whom they had built up a scum read on) and risk my life without any sort of win afterwards for the trouble.
it isnt even that i argue that i would have a good chance to get Wiml to vote for my side. It is just that I think the % is higher that he would over this world.
This is just one of many arguments for why I am town though tbh
I am going to sleep. I need to sleep more than 2-3 hours a night tbh
You two connected a lot emotionally. You basically town read each other for the same thing and parrot each others' reads.
That is always a loss.
Wiml will not have the same mindset as you.
Lets play pretend
Lets say that yesterday was played out the same, but you and Thunal are wolves together and Wiml votes Thunal.
You will have to pick between bringing me and Katze, who have buddied up (tho not as much as you and Thunal), or 1 of us and Wiml, who is now clear.
Idk maybe you pick having me and Katze, and in a way that is more favourable than what I have right now.
I am pretty sure that I would be able, as a wolf, to convince Wiml that one of you and Thunal is a wolf. I think though the best option would be Thunal/Wiml, despite their connection, due to the 1v1 vote but idk. I have no hope convincing you due to the AtE and Katze bringing me down. I am doing this because I want to feel like I gave it my all tbh.
I think you should look at S7G9's lylo where I make this exact argument tbh.
Divagreen did have a lot of emotions she used in S4SF2 so yeah
Also, you have shown how you react to paranoia. You showed that to Vanity on D1 and you even kept going at him (but not sussing) when she was cleared. Everytime I started getting paranoid at you in this game, you got into FOS mode. It has been pretty clear tbh. I dont think scum!Thunal want to take needless risks and I think she expected me to get shot down by you two a long time ago tbh
It is the worst NK decision I could have done. It doesnt matter that Wiml is cleared. Have you never seen wolves take a clear to a F3 before?
Sure, I will stop saying that now. But lol I will not stop making taunts like "lol wolf Thunal" and ask if you are even trying when you try to sell something that isnt true. "Are you even trying" was not even related to this post, but you trying to make it sound like I was super late into calling off Kat/Wiml shots when that wasnt true. And yes, I will say that something is wrong if it is wrong. Your point about the Kat/Wiml shot was wrong.
I am town and I am losing. You are a wolf and you are winning. I will write "lol wolf" whenever I want and how much I want, and there is nothing disrespectful of that tbqfh.
Like, Alexa, are you sure you are not just $%#!ing with me and you are the final wolf?
Here is another example where Thunal is using "false statements" to wolf read me.
I think I will have to go through her counter-points against me from today. They probably have a dozen of "false statements" too tbh
smh post cap...
Like I said before (I think), around the end of eod, when you had voted Kat, it became clear that Wiml was leaning towards Kat. Like my case on you and Thunal happened way before what I am talking about. I am talking about after you voted Kat. Thats afterwards, and Wiml was leaning to that.
I am pretty convinced that my thread state would be better if I had done a late bus before Wiml voted (he even stated he was more at Kat than Thun at a point).
It isnt wolfy that a town player has zero paranoia in a F3 in a Championship finale and doesnt even attempt to look at different angles even once?
Thank you. I rather go down due to Katze antics than emotions.
It is okay. Poison did not really understand it either tbh. The problem is that you are looking at "Would Boq win that F3 from my pov?" over "What pairing does Boq think he has the best chance to win in a F3?" I showed the whole shebang with you and Thunal. Never that I am here in a F3 with you two as a wolf. Never. I take a 5-10% chance to win over a 1% chance to win every single day as a wolf.
Also, I wanna sleep and stuff tbh but i am scared i will wake up to an open thread smh
I have not even argued that I'd push Wiml there if I was a wolf. I'd obviously push the person not being Wiml. I have already said that even. But thank you for clarifying that Alexa/Wiml would be least emotionally attached. I always like it when wolves prove my points tbh
So yes, glad we cleared out that it does hold water. Idc what "any wolf" would do. I am not any wolf tbh, though I do think that the survivability of a me as a wolf does shoot up in an Alexa/Wiml and it is pretty ridiculous that that is being argued against tbh
okay one last time I just cant not.
Thunal, if you lie I will call you out for lying. You'll just have to live with that, just how I have to live with you using intense AtE to get yourself a misclear in this game tbh
@alexa why do I not just abandon ship on Katze after you vote him? I have opportunities to walk back
and lol is this
alexa this is not a brief tinfoil. Like what.
Consider that Vandy had Katze as top town. And who everyone else was in his read list. Actually I will show you tbh
Vandy scum read towns and town read his scum mates. That can be seen here.
lmao wolf Thunal. You are so funny tbh
It is subpar to get stuck with Katze like that, without even wanting to, and it is subpar to make the worst NK decision I could have done (when I choosing NK target is my fav part as mafia). It is both good and bad that I am town tbh.
It means I played $%#!ing subpar D4, D5 and D6. But at least I am doing my best now.
You are correct though that I did not expect you to convince people the way you did. And I do not respect your play for that. I want you to know that. After my misyeet, I will repeat that. And it is actually not that you are convincing atm. I am dying because Katze did a terrific job sticking himself into me and taking me down with them. That plus your AtE are what is dragging me down. I fully respect Katze's play there, even though it is soul-crushing and not how I hoped my championship saga would end. It is what it is.
I am going to stop interacting with Thunal now tbh since that will just waste post count. @ me at preferably several posts at a time if you want me to reply to em and stuff. I am already close to capping and I do not want that to happen tbh. I have also reserved a meme post for when I vote Thunal and in case I am correct here. Actually I am close to voting.
Do you want more time?
I am not Silver. But yes, as wolf I don't care. Not inside the thread. Sometimes, rarely, I care in wolf chat. I dont really remember when I actively pushed someone as wolf because they scum read me, and just keep going and not walking back. The difference is that I know they are town when I am wolf; I dont when I am town. Ergo, a lack of TMI. I am competitive as scum, but my goal as scum is to yeet town. So the only time that matters is eod. Ftr, I was completely cool in my scum game with iaafr hell bussing me. Kinda vibed in the wolf chat and then dvc as iaafr was apologising.
I do not make my whole D1 and then on to D2 about this loop though. Sorry tbh.
Actually Thunal, I dont really feel like answering much else here in your post. I think it is pretty clear to me that you are searching for reasons to scum read me. Like, you first say it isnt at all clearing for a wolf to be openly happy in a bad situation because that cheers town up and you are in good graces with em, but then you immediately turn around and sus me for having that perspective because "why would a town be happy here". Kinda hilarious tbh.
I was feeling peaceful and happy because I was enjoying the moment of playing a difficult game where there were still room to find scum. This is my last championship game and I thought on how much fun it is to play mafia tbh, and I also was starting to form my Alexa scum read at that point iirc? Eh, it was a fun time, and people sitting and being down and sad when they get to play a finale was kinda dumb imo tbh. I also listened to some good music. Good life tbh
Yes I finally gave some short reasons for why I am town but it took Alexa arguing with me for that to happen.
The rest of your sentences are you telling me what I think, which is not something I really care for. My wolf plan would have been the most optimal one. Entering like a gladiator versus two people who are emotionally connected, is not that tbh.
The case of me being a werewolf is that Alexa would have to assume that I played a subpar D6 and D7, throwing away a finale game like that.
@alexa can you try to remove Thunal's emotions in your solve? Like I know it is hard. But it is pretty clear here who of us is in a deep wolf position, who of is set up better, and who here has TMI.
I forgot to another reason why Thunal is wolf.
She has showed today absolute zero paranoia about me. She has said she thinks I am 99% wolf, but I would change that to 100% for her.
Which would be pretty historical.
Here we are in a Championship finale, and one player has zero tinfoil, zero sudden doubt, zero anything close to that. I have literally never seen that happen in a F3, let alone FINALE, where there hasnt been a mech clear. Like, even Poison began doubting her tunnel for some posts during our F3, and she had consistently and confidently scum read me since D1 and had a town read on the scum player.
Thunal knows for sure that I am scum. The only time she has shown any sort of worry today is when she feels like you might reconsider your position.
I have tinfoiled you, I have tinfoiled Thunal.
You have considered different worlds and want to do this properly.
Thunal is for sure I am scum and there is nothing else there. Like look at this p#10318 p#10336
Who has TMI out of us tbh?
She is afraid of going there, to say why I, as town, should vote you over her. Because that could risk her going into your bad books tbh
I showed in post 9074 that I wanted to work together with Wiml. Both those posts are basically saying the same thing.
I yelled out against Wiml voting Katze, though not first but fairly early. Here is my post: p#9164 p#9167
I was inclined to not want a Wiml/Katze cross in p#9143 first btw.
Are you even trying tbh
Before I venture into a sort of "Why Thunal is playing like scum today" I want to clarify why I am tinfoiling you Alexa to even start with, which is also why I understand why you are having difficulties not scum reading me.
If you are a wolf, at worst you did some AtE and a really unnecessary move but it is finales. Whatever. I laughed and clapped my hands after realising that Katze flipped wolf. Because I got $%#!ing played. I was not even mad at Katze, or you, since I was still in that zone. It was finals worthy in a sense. High entertainment. Sure, I have negative emotions about it too that I wont go into, but, like. Yeah. G $%#!ing G I will try my best tomorrow tho.
If Thunal is a wolf, these are wolf posts:
I think Thunal knows what I am talking about here.
Now to some wolfy posts tbh.
Oh look at that. Turns out "lie" = "untrue statement". What a fantastic pointless argument to construct and waste time with instead of just admitting that it is a lie.
So why is this lie extremely wolfy? Well, lets look at Thunal's defence on the matter:
So yes, lets talk about my ten years of experience.
It is very opportunistic.
This also shows that Thunal agrees with me that it would have been +ev for wolf me with Katze to vote first tbh
So to get this straight Thunal
Did I or did I not, oppose Wiml/Katze shot because everyone else was doing that? I cant really keep up with the narratives you are spinning. Both 9074 and 9090 show no sense of fear and are about the same thing ("I wanna work with you if you are town"), and 9074 happens before Wiml mentions that dirty clear.
and to be fair, during that eod, Alexa did try to solve me, or at least interact with me and understand what I was doing. Whereas Thunal had the pitchfork ready tbh.
the problem i am having rn is that i am thinking, what if thunal is a villager and just stubbornly death tunnelling me and Alexa is relaxing there.
But it would be pretty cruel of Alexa to do so. I think she would be able to say to Thunal "meh $%#! this Boq is wolf" and theyd vote me.
And her eod play yesterday doesnt make sense with Kat.
Okay yes, Thunal is the wolf between them tbh.
Meanwhile town was sad and down in the lumps and it was a feels bad man thing. The game just kept going and going and going.
But I found my WIM eventually! Even though it was annoying and feels bad to play.
I start to critically read Pilica in 7871. I might be wrong and stuff. Pilica's play does not equal to how I expect her playing a finale as scum, since she loves the scum rand. Her game plan is just.. bad if wolf. And though I voted Pilica, I thought how it was like any yeet where a town in the poe is misyeeted (complacent). I think that I would look horrible if Pilica flips wolf for the same reason Katze flips wolf. She completely stuck herself to me and I know how other town reacts when that happens. It made me paranoid. Like, I expected to be death tunnelled if she flipped wolf, which is what I am being here.
And it makes me irritated that I did not think about this with Katze yesterday. But I was so into the whole you/Thunal thing and f5 eods are stressful.
My thought process during that whole eod was like $%#!fuckfuck$%#! pilica sounds town, i need to do something, this doesnt make sense, but what if i am wrong and like misclear her, then i will be scum read and I will be screwed tomorrow. I also would want that wolf pelt if she IS a wolf. And like, I am usually wrong and stuff.
I do wish that I tried to stop her yeet more. I did try though. During that eod I voted Wiml. I thought he had made some wolfy posts and I was working up my courage to vote him again. I talked about this with you during that eod.
The Pilica yeet was disgusting because we were complacent in a finale.
I have only slept for 15 hours total the last five days so will try to be as coherent as possible.
Why I am so townie,
or, how I am a hero, a visionary and, excuse my language, a damn good gentleman tbh
An essay written by B. Bookcase "tbh" Bosquee
Disclaimer, this essay includes self-meta and you might wonder how that works when I have said that I dislike self-meta in this game. I have made a meme to make it more easily accessable.
Chapter 1 - My mentality,
The story of a young Boq growing up in a poor Stockholm suburb in the 1920s tbh
Lets start with how I began my game at D1. At sod1 I just try to meme and vibe, but also solve. I ask Thunal a question on a read I find bad and I do that to get a solve on her. However the thread leaders dislike me and I don't feel like I fit in in the town core. I have missed the train yet again. This is something that negatively affects me and makes me meme less. Anyway. I try to form reads and my reads are formed by looking at how people treat me. This is based on me knowing I am town so I look how players act towards a town player, if it is scummy etc.
The thing that makes me townie here is how I approach sods and this D1 in general. I want to be at the major players' table but I am left in the dust. This completely enwraps my mind and I keep looping about how I do not want to repeat past games. This is not the approach I have as wolf. I simply do not care about this as wolf and it is not theatrics that is helping me, but I keep falling back to it.
My first scum reads are based on how people act to me, as I stated. I make self-centred reads and react. This can be seen when I react to Alexa and Vandy shading me the same way during D1. I also care about my posts being read and both meme and get passive-aggressive as I feel shunned. As a wolf, I dont care.
At the same time I think my early pushes are good? This is why I scum read Wisdom. I legitimately think this is wolfy p#1094
Like I think the best way to describe my D1 is rattled.
My scum reads kinda dont work, but I decide to town cases on Katze, Gorf, Alexa and Wiml. Yes, Katze, and I will return to that point in a later chapter. This is something I have never done as scum afaik tbh. Not this excessively at least.
During both D2 and D3 I am still caught in this "this is a repeat of past games help" but I think one really good argument to see that my mentality is townie and not scummy is actually around D6. Mostly because honestly, it is super hard to recite my mindset in detail. When everyone was being a downer, I was being happy. Or at least, not really sad, and I showed that in posts. I tried to cheer people up and said I liked the challenge and stuff. Wolves want to mimic the tone of players when the thread is being sad. They do not want to come off as happy because they are scared about looking bad. This can be seen in Didney Worl when I make sure to have my public mindset similar to the thread's. Here I don't.
Another mentality that does not fit with a wolf is how I approached today. Alexa wanted me to immediately town case myself, but I refuse. I pick fights with both of you instead and say I want to do things in the order I want, not anyone else. And clearly, regardless of the alignment you think I have, I havent given up. So my wolf plan here is to just do my own thing and try to solve? How does that help me? Being able to read the thread state is something I can do as both alignments. I appease as scum because being agreeable is generally better.
The town plan I stated was "I want to find the last wolf, make a last solve, play the game to the fullest tbh!"
I dont see my wolf plan. Like, I am not even trying to set doubt in any of you two because I am not saying who I scum read. I am just saying I wanna solve. I start arguing with you guys. That is not a wolf agenda.
Chapter 2 - Partnership
I am not like the other power wolves tbh
This will answer Alexa's post/question about powerwolf tbh
I do understand that it looked like I power wolfed with Katze, but that is not how I powerwolf. I dont think I have ever strongly town read a wolf partner before. Not to this extent. That is simply not how I play. But I want to give attention to one post I made at eod1.
Regarding Katze, as I said, I do not town read my partners that hard as scum. This can be proven in my wolf games. S4G11, S5G8, Didney Worl, and even the game I played where I got yeeted at D1. I dont do that because I am always afraid of looking partnery. In Didney Worl, I was one of the few people who actually pressed Marl before he was "cleared". I voted both Marl and Misty. But at the mylo, whilst I had Misty as a potential wolf, I never bring up that many arguments and I just home into one town player. In this game's F5, I look at all the team possibilities. I push every player alive at that point. I make a big post about it.
Hell, in Throne Mash (where I was sorta second mafia alignment) I go into a 1v1 against my last teammate to get one of us cleared.
Finally, lets pretend that I am wolf with Katze. Firstly, I still think that I will be the one to vote first of us. Because I have this massive town cred. I think I have a much bigger chance to win a cross against a town than Katze. Secondly, lets pretend I dont. During eod, it looked like, imo, that Katze was going down due to the massive AtE pressure on Wiml. I had a conversation with Alexa at the time about wifom. I think I would have walked back on Katze and voted them at that point to keep my town cred. It would create a better thread state for me regardless tbh. When Alexa made her vote, there was nothing really stopping me from voting Katze too in a desperate attempt.
But I did not. Just like how I stayed on Vandy, despite saying "man this is a bit villagery huh". Going back to that, you can also see my thought process there. I react like this to a Gorf post:
Meanwhile, prior to this, I say it is shady that people are throwing out Pilica scum reads:
p#1953 and p#2048
There is no wolf agenda at all here.
Another Katze point is that I brought up how Vandy might have TMI read Katze as wolf. If mine and Katze's supposedly wolf plan is to just buddy up forever, then that is counter-productive to that plan. Like it isnt even a lowkey post. I put effort into it.
These are independent solving of Vandy that leads me to start sussing Katze a little. I am alone in the thread when I did those posts. Then when I came back to the thread I began town reading Katze due to how the thread state was plus a post they made. I do return to this Vandy read later. At the same time, there is not really any big conclusion. I did all that solving... because? I did not try to bus here. It isnt distancing because my next posts after the last one I quoted are about how I town read Katze again. That is the lamest distancing attempt ever that I dismantle myself. Which I just dont do as a wolf.
I also want to bring up that Katze was the one who really held me close to them and not the opposite during the F5 cross. There were lots of "Boq and I did that", "Boq and I are not doing this". I did not. I sent a heart and two memes to/about Katze. This should show that Katze was taking me down with them.
These are just a few.
Katze spends A LOT of their eod to just hardcore town read me. These are a few effects:
-I get emotionally close to Katze because they are defending me and agreeing with my things. Katze never questions my read on Alexa. All this makes it really hard for me to re-evaluate at the moment because Katze seems to "get" me. If Katze survives and is teamed with Thunal, I will have a difficult time to vote them in the upcoming day.
-Katze and I get comically super close in interactions. Like this is level 0 close. This is to drag me down through being associated with Katze. So when Katze died, I am completely $%#!ed.
To believe that I am teamed with Katze, you have to believe that I as a wolf would be down to do this sort of play that I have never really done before. Knowing fully well how that it will backfire on me, and not vote Katze to help me keep some town cred the next day. All to win this F5? F5s can be lost and Katze town reading and defending me through a big chunk of the F5 cross does not move the game forward to a Thunal yeet. It only accomplishes moving Katze and I together. That is a stupid plan.
You have to believe that I start on my own, case Vandy and end up sussing Katze just to walk back on it afterwards, and to start tinfoiling Vandy being villagerey as he is going to get yeeted. The only thing this shows is that I do not have TMI. This is not how I power wolf. This shows that I am a villager with a transparent thought process who keep re-evaluating his reads.
Chapter 3 - F5 confidence
The perspective of a lost soul tbh
The point about this chapter is to counter the argument that my eod push was wolfy. It does require you to see things from my town pov.
But first let's counter another argument. So I got my "weak read" on Alexa. I call it strong. This is basic rhetorics that town uses. You call something a confident read at first because it has a higher success to be followed. I believe both alignments do this and it is not wolfy. I have talked about this in spec chat tbh.
Weak read does not mean it isnt a read. I do believe it. Aside from the posts of Alexa, which I at that time think show a wolf perspective, I am noticing that Katze does not want to cross with Alexa nor do they want to push there. They want to push Thunal. I feel really confident it is Kat/Alexa, though I am wavering on Katze a little. And I am wavering on Alexa enough to not vote. I have already shown my thought process here with Kat. It is annoying that both of you have said basically "yeh but it doesnt matter since you changed your read to Thunal". Like, that is just lazy play. Of course it matters. Is it theatre or real progression? It looks real to me and organic. I make several posts where I start to pressure Katze. Why would I even start pressuring Kat and start tinfoil them if our plan is to be best friends forever? I also made it clear that my strat was to see who Alexa would vote and solve after that to maybe catch 2 wolves. That should be in the last chapter but whatever lmao.
Lets first look at the Alexa posts where I felt like she was only interested in engaging with Wiml and not interested in asking me questions (like Wiml did even tho I was not able to answer).
The feeling I got was that I was getting pre-flipped tbh. It isnt the best, but it was how I felt which increased my confbias.
Time to look at the buddy-buddy relationship of Alexa and Thunal.
p#9690 - Alexa
#9756 - Thunal (she read my whole post and only reacted to this, according to herself "because it was bad".
p#9767 - Alexa
p#9769 - Thunal
p#9777 - Thunal
p#9781 - Alexa
p#9787 - Alexa
p#9807 - Thunal
p#9815 - Thunal
p#9852 - Thunal says that there are interactions between her and Alexa that makes them never w/w. Interesting.
p#9860 - Thunal
p#9863 - Alexa
p#9886 - Thunal ("no they arent")
p#9887 - Alexa (I am not a wolf though and neither is Thunal)
p#9892 - Thunal
p#9916 - Alexa, defending an Alexa/Thunal team
p#9929 - Alexa
p#9931 - Thunal. Both Alexa and Thunal opposes my point around the same time. Made me feel like it was a tag team bury.
p#9938 - Alexa
p#9952 - Thunal
p#9958 - Thunal, this looked super teamie from my pov
p#9961 - Alexa
p#9967 - Thunal. Thunal is town because according to herself it would be gross to fake these emotions.
p#9970 - Alexa
p#9995 - Thunal
p#9997 - Alexa. Thunal is town because she would never fake these emotions.
p#9999 - Thunal. Lol I $%#!ing love that I have to decide who of you two is the wolf tbh
p#10033 - Thunal. "Alexa is town non-emotionally because..."
p#10038 - Alexa. "Thunal is town non-emotionally because..."
These are just so partnery. Not all of them are scummy mind you.
THIS IS JUST DEFENDING A TOWN READ!!!
Like how Katze defended me?
WE WERE IN SYNC AND AGREED!!!
Just like I and Katze?
The main diff is that I dont obsessively talk about why Katze is town at that cross. I talk about that I think Thunal and Alexa are scum.
I was shaded today for not trying to solve Thunal/Alexa during the eod. But lmao right back at you.
I dont think anyone can with a straight face claim that from a third party's pov, this is teamy. Of course I am going to look at it that way, just like how the town inside Thunal/Alexa thinks that I and Katze are scum because of how Katze just stuck themselves to me. The problem for me is that both of you stuck to each other. You both emotionally town read each other AND town read each other for the general approach. You both defend each other.
From my pov, Wiml is town. I have had him as town for quite some time. I am left with Kat/Alexa/Thunal. Here I see two players blatantly teaming up with each other. Of course I will scum read this. And you cannot argue against it, because you scum read me for similar reasons. Why would I add any of you two in a Katze team at this point in time of the game when this happens?
So I got duped by Katze, and one of you is duped by the other tbh.
This is also why I do not bring you two to this F3. It doesnt matter that Wiml made up some team order at the last day. You two are emotionally town reading each other. There is no chance in hell that I will be able to break that as scum. Never.
All I can hope for is that the town inside you guys can see this.
Chapter 4 - Towncred
And how to ruin friendships
To believe I am scum, you will also believe that I ruined my town cred/being top town. For a level 0 push, where my partner aligns themselves to me like a tick. And to ruin relationships like these posts:
Both of you hardcore town read me prior. I am being town read by Thunal for not jumping to conclusions. My game plan then is to jump to a conclusion on Alexa, who thinks I am the likeliest villager alive.
Sure I would need to, perhaps, alienate one of you if I am wolf and about to cross (if I dont choose Wiml but thats unlikely since I have said Wiml is townie). Instead I choose to alienate both of you. That does not make sense as a wolf agenda. Not only do I completely ruin my town cred, but Katze is running amok saying that I am super villagerey. This does not happen.
Chapter 3 and 4 shows why it is not weird for me to scum read both of Thunal/Alexa tbh.
Chapter 5 - Conclusion
I am not scum because my thought process has been pure and transparent through the whole game. I have shown lack of TMI with my wolf mates. I have approached this game in a manner that I do as town but not as a wolf. In my cases you can see that I re-evaluate since the reads are ever-changing, not constant and consistent. I try to challenge my own TSF read. I interact with TSF about it. My cases on Wisdom, Vanity and JC are not wolfy, two of the cases were agreed upon by the thread. I re-evaluate Pilica when I dont have to, protect her, and she finds me as town instantly all before that. Before we even interact. I even try to trap her when she was saying what her expectations are for my scum game and then walk back on it and town read her. I walked back my Katze reads back and right, but I have walked back every single read I have done in this game. I have resetted the walk back and walked into the read again and scum read the same person several times (Thunal). That shows townie thought. Not scum with agenda. I was completely duped by Katze and sent to this F3 just to suffer without a $%#!ing backup plan. I. Am. Town.