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  1. Postgame#3275

    Thread: Serenes Forest Invitational

    by fairyjigglypuff
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    Completed ood game everyone! scumteam really worked well...

    ood game everyone! scumteam really worked well this game imo was fun playing with you guys

    Quote Originally Posted by jumpluff (#3273)
    the discord link is in the graveyard link, which is in the modbot post at game's end

    will we get to know some about NKs?
    the NKs were designed to be sensible while avoiding NKing obvtowns as much as we could
    we nk’d marth n1 because they were towny enough to make sense as a nk
    but the more people we killed out of the towncore (amy/supa/dunn) the more likely the pb slot would be sussed for “surviving too long”
    the orange nk was done because of my tmi on that slot, making it another “sensible” nk

    hope that makes sense
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    Completed its not that i have a grasp on fen’s meta fen...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#1839)
    Quote Originally Posted by Bartozio (#1837)
    @Ampharos I don't know fjp too well, but the case doesn't read tmi for me. Assuming Fenrir indeed always uses a lot of words to say nothing, not being convinced to scumread him for it, but being convinced to townread him for not doing it makes sense?
    Does the shift in confidence level wrt ability to read the slot not strike you as odd?

    FJP this game sounds like he has a legitimately solid grasp of Fenrir's meta and what to look for.

    FJP in Marblelympics says he "always winds up scumreading Fen" and basically punts on the slot.

    It's weird.
    its not that i have a grasp on fen’s meta
    fen has posted really scummily as town (see color wheel team mafia, the team game before marbleympics)
    its just that fen this game was strikingly different from what i’ve seen previously
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    Completed the thing is marbleympics was a team game and i...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#1793)
    fjp in marblelympics vs fjp here is pretty apples and oranges because fjp was legitimately very invested in marblelympics and posted in real time for a good chunk of the game; i don't necessarily think his failure to do so here is NAI so i struggle to ding him for things like "reads delivered much less naturally" that i would otherwise be riding his $%#! for

    i do think it's interesting the way he talks about fenrir in that game, though

    compare this:

    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#556)
    fen has a habit of using 192947299 words to say a whole lot of nothing

    problem is he does that as both alignments soooo
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#584)
    Quote Originally Posted by Fenrir (#573)
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#556)
    fen has a habit of using 192947299 words to say a whole lot of nothing

    problem is he does that as both alignments soooo
    You can fight me irl, also hi fjp how are you

    Tl;dr though since Xalt also was wondering about my reads, I'm currently leaning town towards Logic, Monstrman, Beck In Italics, and potentially Chem, in roughly that order and I'm not liking Xalt or Elephant (currently liking Elephant less).
    whats up my dude
    i always end up sring you so tg for team mafia
    imma give a +1 to your beck/logic trs, notsomuch chem/monsterman


    to this:

    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1428)
    ok i skimmed thread once, currently partway through a more detailed reread
    first big takeaway is that im more solid on my fen tr
    amy brought up marbleympics as an example of scumfen making wallposts, but i see a distinction between the wallpost fen made there and the one they made this game

    see
    scumfen juices up his posts in marbleympics to make what could have been said in like a few sentences become an essay
    adding meaningless fluff throughout
    fen’s pushes in the marbleympics wallpost also like makes no sense - they were bullshitting imo

    this game’s wallpost is different
    every sentence has a purpose in clearly outlining their thought process
    the vast majority of this content was original, and isnt relying on or bouncing off of other people’s content
    they also dont safetynet their opinions like they did in marbleympics
    overall the two wallposts are very tonally distinct; hard townvibes

    i also dont see why fen’s eod was scummy? its clear fen wasnt paying very close attention to thread due to oog reasons, and they did what they could in getting off dunn
    the athena wagon was a cfd and not based on new information that cropped up either, so like it makes sense that fen didnt feel all that convinced
    the wallpost in this game also put athena as towny so it checks out here too
    if anything, i think scumfen would have hopped on the athena wagon for towncred - hes more than capable of bullshitting a wallpost to “justify” it too

    can someone tell me how to quote posts from other threads so i can put it here as a side by side


    and just for completion's sake, here's the fen wall in marblelympics:

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenrir (#477)
    This game's gonna be a ton of chaos and I fear I'll never be truly caught up :worried: I was kind of hoping tbh that with 30 players it'd be some time before serious things happened o7

    The first instinct I have reading through the thread is to townread Beck starting on page 2 with his attempt asking people why they wanted to go Day 1, but I'm also v paranoid regarding doing that just as a result of knowing Beck's reputation/that he's a big name. I don't think we've ever played together, so I don't have any reference frame in that sense. (Sidenote fwiw: I'm here Day 1 because no one else wanted to >_< Neither did I, but hopefully this is less overwhelming than coming into a D2/3 with 100+ pages.)

    I could possibly vibe with Monstrman's suggestion at the bottom of P2 that only one wolf had posted in that time. The overall first couple of pages feels relatively pure to me in the sense of nothing pinging me outright. There were a couple of responses to this (ShR/Kajit) which questioned the merits of reading so many people as town so early, which feels off to me for some reason as a mentality to have? It wasn't the vibe I got personally that Monstrman was saying, "These nine people are locktown" since there was no indicator of who that one wolf would be. I think it's funny (in a humor sense, not a "this is odd" sense) that right after I typed this I got to multiple posts at the bottom of page 3 where people mentioned not liking ShR so far.

    Disliking Elephantality's entrance post (126). I felt like there was potentially some kind of culture clash going on here since the read as a whole to me felt v rigid (i.e. citing someone's decision to RVS as a towntell) but soured on it more because he calls Sulit scum for making a read and not interacting with the thread, and then he makes a read and doesn't interact with the thread beyond things meant directly for him. His subsequent "everyone needs to be voting" post and multiple references to the importance of a "pro-town environment" are also giving me LAMIST vibes. By this point in the thread, I don't personally have any vibes on Sulit myself, and while I mentioned a light take on Kajot above it's nothing I'm willing to ride or die on (and if I was it'd lean me in the opposite direction Elephantality goes here).

    Not sure yet how to reconcile this read with ShR and Logic also scumreading the slot for what I feel are different reasons (rigid tone/seriousness/incorrect voting format, only the first of which I'd consider a potential tell). I do like the pressure Logic puts on the slot following this, as well as his later approach to Beck.

    Maybe I still can't toneread people, since Duk3 by page 4 apparently thinks everyone's forced and I only get that vibe from Elephantality. No one rings overwhelmingly pure, but people being forced as a vibe wasn't on my mind at all.

    The posts that Xalt chooses to respond to upon entering are ??? (why they chose to go first/the "pro-town environment" deal). A lot of their content so far's reactionary/playing devil's advocate to things other people do and I don't feel it puts forth many original opinions, so that's what I want to see more of from Xalt since they seem to have a pretty good grasp as far as getting caught up with the thread goes. I'm wanting to say I feel slightly better on Beck for the mindmeld tied to his bringing up something similar re: Xalt's read on Elephantality.

    I need to get water/Tylenol b/c I feel a dehydration headache coming on, then there are some shorter one-line questions I had based on a couple of the posts I read along the way. Neither Jona nor AM's been in yet, so all of this is from me.

    and here's his wall here:

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenrir (#715)
    Dunn's behavior on page 2, as well as subsequent trends through the day, reminds me of his gameplay in Arctic Mafia, in which he was a wolf. The posts Makaze quoted in p#100 ping me as being quick to shut down potential townreads as opposed to advocating wariness regarding forming early reads (which in itself isn't a terrible thing either). He also seemed unconcerned with this line of thinking when Amy initially passed a townread on him, only acknowledging that opinion when asked about it directly.

    He's additionally been low-content for most of the day so far [similar Arctic trend and in fact the thing that I remember as leading to his elimination in that game] despite having had a pretty consistent presence compared to players like FJP/Ariadne (more on them further down). When he finally starts having more in-depth conversations with people, it pertains to them not reading him favorably (see p#462 and subsequent posts) and he feels less interested in trying to solve people's slots and more in finding things to call out/push.

    Amy's currently my strongest townread; I like the balance of her early behavior (e.g. it doesn't feel like she's trying too hard either way too appear too casual or too game-focused) and I feel she's been the primary individual pushing people to take stances and give their takes on matters.

    I've got a sentence from my earlier notes saying "I want to like YOLOSWAG but need to see more", not sure on a skim of their ISO what it was I liked but I'll give it a second look following this.

    I start to lean town on Makaze seeing their response to Claire's Aizen-rp in p#164, mostly b/c it resembles what I recall of my own initial reaction to said Aizen-rp in the other game Claire used it in.

    P#226 makes me feel, to quote earlier me, "some kinda way on Shinori, but I can't tell what kinda way." Makaze's posts surrounding it don't do much to ping me. Re: Amy's p#275, I only have Training Mafia as a frame of reference for Makaze's gameplay but based on that game (thinking particularly of the gutreads on Fable/Evan that expanded into multi-day thunderdomes, p#387 and the surrounding interactions with Dunn reminded me of this especially) I vibe with the first part of that post. To me though the discussion/subsequent back down with Shinori felt relatively natural and (1)I don't know what the incentive would be for scum!Makaze to back down quickly if he'd already put the thought out there and (2)I'm curious on how Makaze's wolf meta is in particular [for anyone who has reference on that]: is wolf!Makaze specifically more hesitant, or does it boil down more to town!Makaze not being known for hesitating? They don't strike me as the type who'd back down as either alignment, which is why I'm not inclined to read their doing so as AI.

    I don't like ariadne's p#299, as it feels like she felt the need to comment on her vote being on Makaze since others began to wagon there. Felt it was trying to parrot the sentiments of others while sounding original. On first read ariadne's later posts didn't swing me either way, so ISO work will probably be on my to-do list for however long I stay awake tonight.

    I vibed on Athena's entrance posts as town on first instinct, but didn't have anything specific that made me feel confident in it.

    Continually found myself holding off on reading Chelsea due to fear of misreading her due to her reputation as a strong player, forcing myself to ISO her and come to a conclusion also goes onto the to-do list.

    I recall hearing at some point that town!Shinori has a tendency towards tunneling, which'd align with their current behavior towards Makaze. Also find myself liking Shinori's ability to inquire elsewhere at the same time as engaging in this tunnel as well as their persistence and pressing for answers from Makaze within the tunnel itself.

    While I don't agree with the line of thought being taken in p#392 at all, the mindset/introspection required for the mental gymnastics required for this are imo >rand v. Scum, imo, stops at calling the quoted posts vague as opposed to detailing the bit about trying to get other to make the case.

    I think Mackc2 is town, primarily for his attention on Chelsea, which admittedly stems in part from the fact that I don't think scum!Mack picks Chelsea to go after when there's been little attention on her prior to p#406. But I also like his follow-up questioning in his interactions with Chelsea.

    I've got "Marth v" written down a few times throughout my notes, citing "mild mindmeld vibes" and I'm for the moment content to sheep past me's opinion, as they've had similar initial reactions that I did to Dunn, Mack, and Athena (though I don't think I'm as confident as they are on Athena).

    Wrote down that some of what Shinori wrote in p#451 makes me want to re-evaluate Makaze, added to to-do list.

    Don't like FJP's p#452 for how it delves into the Makaze v. Shinori conflict and doesn't come away with any coherent read on Makaze's alignment while also showing no drive to fix this problem despite Makaze's prominence as a conversation topic and wagon. I'm also curious what drew his attention to Athena over others itg; his read on Athena also doesn't seem concerned with looking deeper into Athena.

    Since @Dunnstral claimed to be the expert on reading Claire and votes her in p#456, and as mentioned above I've so far put off reading Claire longer than I probably should've, I want to know how and if Dunn's meta on her affects his read at all (independent of the reasons cited in 456, unless you feel those reasons are tied explicitly to her meta).


    so i actually do think that fen's wall looks better here than it did in marblelympics

    but based on fjp's approach to fen in marblelympics i really just... struggle to buy that he arrived at this conclusion naturally

    feels like tmi
    the thing is
    marbleympics was a team game
    and i had no reason to try to sort fen when i knew ftf (someone i can read a lot easier) was coming in later
    i saw amy’s post about fen being capable of wallposting as scum, but in this game i didnt feel the same word salad vibe i usually feel from their wallposts
    so i decided to compare the two walls and it was pretty night vs day
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    Completed uhh i never voted claire much less even expressed...

    Quote Originally Posted by supa2 (#1788)
    Quote Originally Posted by Athena_57 (#513)
    FJP's string of posts is not good. Only sumleans are makaze/me which is p opportunistic

    He just goes "Ye, that 6 man stack on makaze, idk but i can see it maybe", throws a lazy vote on me, states like one townread and peaces out
    Quote Originally Posted by Athena_57 (#519)
    I'm going to do some ISO's before I vote but for now:

    Makaze still looks pushable but I kinda want the people on him ot do that bc rn it's mostly jus shinori
    Ariadne is a bad push imo, idt Bart is insincere but I feel like hehasn't reacted to the stuff posted overnigth yet so i'm kinda curious where that goes

    Dunn/Claire wagons I have no strong opinion yet one bc I find those two hard to read on a skim, so I'm going to ISO both

    Might join one of those if I like the cases on them, might vote FJP if I don't
    Quote Originally Posted by Athena_57 (#522)
    Quote Originally Posted by Athena_57 (#519)
    I'm going to do some ISO's before I vote but for now:

    Makaze still looks pushable but I kinda want the people on him ot do that bc rn it's mostly jus shinori
    Ariadne is a bad push imo, idt Bart is insincere but I feel like hehasn't reacted to the stuff posted overnigth yet so i'm kinda curious where that goes

    Dunn/Claire wagons I have no strong opinion yet one bc I find those two hard to read on a skim, so I'm going to ISO both

    Might join one of those if I like the cases on them, might vote FJP if I don't
    Yeah idk I don't feel super strongly about either the dunn or the claire wagon. Cases on claire look like they come from a good place but I overall like what she's been doing. I could sheep Marth's vote on Dunn for voteparking but I feel stronger about fjp and kinda like him voting claire. He'd be my second choice but I'm down to do this until I see where he takes his Claire read.

    ##Vote fairyjigglypuff
    Quote Originally Posted by Athena_57 (#834)
    So yeah I stand by my statement that FJP's entry was super opportunistic and shallow
    Not feeling the town!bart that I usually feel when we play
    If I had to pick someone in the claire/yolo/dunn group it's dunn but I'm not sold on there being a scum in there
    Mak/Shino both scummy, mak is worse

    idk if i want to share townreads beyond the 3 lowposters i mentioned

    Those are the lazy scumreads, effort scumreads are probably in my nullpool but i dont rly want to look there yet until we get interactions
    Quote Originally Posted by Athena_57 (#836)
    Quote Originally Posted by Paperblade (#799)
    I should read through the counting boys + fjp
    you better not be counting me as part of the counting boys
    Quote Originally Posted by Athena_57 (#851)
    Quote Originally Posted by Athena_57 (#850)
    uhh hashed it out quickly bc my laptop notified me it's resetting for updates soon but ill see if i can get out more

    fjp votes disappearing is sad but natural given that he's afk
    and also I lowkey forgot the amy wagon even was a thing so ig ill check why that happened and disappeared
    That mention of liking FJP for voting claire even though he said 'yeah I kinda like claire' is so $%#!ing weird lol. Maybe you're on to something
    uhh i never voted claire much less even expressed suspicion on them
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    Completed i saw some posts about not letting the wagon get...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#1781)
    here's the exchange from d2 where fjp first expresses suspicion of yolo

    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1434)
    Quote Originally Posted by YOLOSWAG (#1433)
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1431)
    you just called fen scummy like 30 minutes ago what
    And last night I gut townread him. I'm having dissonance on him; that post is entertaining a world where he's town.
    im having trouble reconciling these last few posts from you
    you thought fen was townie yesterday
    you currently think fen’s scummy, but not as scummy as fen was in marble
    but you clearly think they’re scummy enough to knock them into scumlean/scumread territory
    i feel like you said fen is better here than in marbleympics just to agree with me


    here's his next post in the thread, 10 hours later

    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1529)
    fjp here
    i just woke up and i have class starting in a few minutes
    i havent had time to continue the deep reread i was doing
    didnt like yolo's reaction to my fen case
    just made a surface level comment on it and then kinda walked back his earlier sr of fen by saying he's "better than marbleympics"
    but like yolo's team didnt even vote fen in that game
    i didnt comb over that thread to see if they hard sr'd fen at any point but like
    the "better than marbleympics" statement just sounds disingenuous
    also saw a post from them sod2 saying bbm should never have been the vig shot but like
    i didn't see yolo criticizing the shot when amy called for it eod1
    not a good look

    ##Vote YOLOSWAG


    obviously the time gap is at least partially explainable by sleep, thanks to timezones

    but... you're clearly repping a scumread on yolo in that first post

    and you've previously expressed a townread on claire

    so i'm unsure as to why you waited till after a sleep and a written case to vote yolo?

    fjp actually doesn't have a single natural vote this game. he's only got 2 total (athena and yolo) and both of them were after cases. i'm gonna iso him in marblelympics but i don't think town!fjp avoided voting like a normal human being in that game, iirc
    i saw some posts about not letting the wagon get too close to hammer prior to making those posts about yolo
    yolo already had like 6/7 votes at that moment and i made my suspicions clear so i just didnt vote
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    Completed my post following my athena push didnt mention...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#1779)
    Quote Originally Posted by supa2 (#1775)
    I dunno Amy I'm pretty sure Athena actively was giving crap to FJP back as well

    Is that just distancing?
    Yeah, so here's the thing.

    FJP voted Athena in his second to last post of D1. His last post of D1 was 2 posts later and didn't mention Athena at all. Zero attempt at actually forwarding the wagon, and zero prelude to the read either. It's read that exists in a vacuum and is made by a player firmly in the PoE (this was after the 4 vote FJP wagon had already dissipated, but he was still at the bottom of a lot of lists) and makes no real effort to actually affect the gamestate. In other words, textbook distancing.

    Athena's discussion of FJP is a bit harder to reconcile, because it's more of a real push. He actually talks about FJP and asks others' opinions before making the vote. BUT... he moves his vote to Bartozio when he's in no real danger (it's close-ish to EoD and Mak/Dunn wagons look unstoppable). He keeps a scumread on FJP but tries this Bart thing instead.

    The other weird thing is that Athena, from what I can tell, completely ignores FJP's vote on him. No attempt to defuse, or use it to build a stronger case, or anything of the sort. Just ignored. I FEEL like this is more w/w indicative than w/v indicative - think wolves have a much easier time ignoring votes from teammates (and thus votes they can ultimately exert some degree of control over) than votes from villagers.

    So like. Yeah he probably doesn't wanna disturb the top wagons, but there's a pretty cogent argument to be made that Athena doesn't really give a $%#! about seeing FJP dead, and that his vote there was largely just content for content's sake. I don't know that it's necessarily the most wolf-indicative thing in the world? But I think to call it townspew ignores a lot of context behind Athena's posting.
    my post following my athena push didnt mention athena because i didnt feel the need to
    i said everything i wanted to say about athena at that moment
    and i really wanted to get my thoughts on shinori since a)they made a flurry of posts during the time i was writing the aforementioned wallpost and b)isoing that slot including said new posts was important for sorting the first case i tackled in my wallpost

    i saw athena’s countervote onto me before eod1 and was planning on shredding it
    but i just didnt have the time
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    Completed its called i have work and 5pm dls are just...

    Quote Originally Posted by Makaze (#2047)
    Even if I didn't want to sheep Amy, I do think it's fairy.

    Ignoring all the other cases, these timestamps are bad:

    Last post D1:
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#454)
    read shinori’s iso

    the makaze case they’re pushing is like
    tonally 1000000% town
    and point 4 in that wall is especially a big vibe
    i still dont agree with the whole “make content before you get pushed” thing cuz like
    its not like players choose when they get pushed
    Last post D2:
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1529)
    fjp here
    i just woke up and i have class starting in a few minutes
    i havent had time to continue the deep reread i was doing
    didnt like yolo's reaction to my fen case
    just made a surface level comment on it and then kinda walked back his earlier sr of fen by saying he's "better than marbleympics"
    but like yolo's team didnt even vote fen in that game
    i didnt comb over that thread to see if they hard sr'd fen at any point but like
    the "better than marbleympics" statement just sounds disingenuous
    also saw a post from them sod2 saying bbm should never have been the vig shot but like
    i didn't see yolo criticizing the shot when amy called for it eod1
    not a good look

    ##Vote YOLOSWAG
    Only posts D3:
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1919)
    ok ive been absolutely canned the last few days
    will have more time in the next few days; sorry everyone
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1922)
    i have 15 minutes
    i get the chelsea wagon based on stuff from previous gamedays but can someone give me a tldr of the bart wagon
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1934)
    Quote Originally Posted by Paperblade (#1926)
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1922)
    i have 15 minutes
    i get the chelsea wagon based on stuff from previous gamedays but can someone give me a tldr of the bart wagon
    jumped on the dunn wagon kind of suddenly when it pushed it over the other wagons when he was scumreading them more until that point
    tunneled claire D2 onward and hasn't really updated his reads or felt like he was trying to gamesolve
    ok sure sold
    ##Vote Bartozio
    Despite having the most content on D1, they ducked out early after voting Athena and rode the towncred. Then they managed to show up and vote for town at EoD for every wagon after. I think they vote parked him and let things happen and lurked that EoD instead of posting. This fits Amy's accusation of riding their Athena spew and sniping at eod.

    A part of me thinks they showed up last night because they got warned. Based on what happened in previous days they never posted at their usual time throughout the phase and then somehow showed up to sheep the main wagon yet again despite them having to have had time to at least read something throughout the day. They would also have no choice but to nk Amy after how that ended.

    I think this would spew Fen and look bad for Shinori based on the depth of these arguments based on their content in P#454 and Amy's arguments in #1793.

    I still think it's Sully no matter what and don't think they should fall under the radar behind fjp.

    I'd like to see more of Shinori and Sully if they're around.

    Lim priority:

    fjp/Sully > ariadne > woopons/Chelsea > orange/Shinori

    ##Vote fairyjigglypuff
    its called i have work
    and 5pm dls are just amazing
    i only came in yday because i was prodded and i used my lunch break to post
    fyi not making it this eod

    im guessing amy cased me last day phase? i guess i’ll look for that
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    Completed who are you talking to

    Quote Originally Posted by Makaze (#2177)
    this must be how amy feels when she says im weirdchamping

    Quote Originally Posted by Makaze (#2174)
    what are you thinking
    that was @orangeandblack5 but you can answer too
    who are you talking to
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    Completed ok i skimmed this day phase and uh i see one...

    ok i skimmed this day phase
    and uh
    i see one wall on me from makaze?
    thats it?
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    Completed huh why am i being wagoned rn wasnt i tr’d before

    huh why am i being wagoned rn
    wasnt i tr’d before
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    Completed frittata jambalaya papaya whats up im here...

    frittata
    jambalaya
    papaya

    whats up im here ready to rock n roll
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    Completed ok sure sold Bartozio

    Quote Originally Posted by Paperblade (#1926)
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1922)
    i have 15 minutes
    i get the chelsea wagon based on stuff from previous gamedays but can someone give me a tldr of the bart wagon
    jumped on the dunn wagon kind of suddenly when it pushed it over the other wagons when he was scumreading them more until that point
    tunneled claire D2 onward and hasn't really updated his reads or felt like he was trying to gamesolve
    ok sure sold
    ##Vote Bartozio
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    Completed i have 15 minutes i get the chelsea wagon based...

    i have 15 minutes
    i get the chelsea wagon based on stuff from previous gamedays but can someone give me a tldr of the bart wagon
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    Completed ok ive been absolutely canned the last few days...

    ok ive been absolutely canned the last few days
    will have more time in the next few days; sorry everyone
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    Completed fjp here i just woke up and i have class...

    fjp here
    i just woke up and i have class starting in a few minutes
    i havent had time to continue the deep reread i was doing
    didnt like yolo's reaction to my fen case
    just made a surface level comment on it and then kinda walked back his earlier sr of fen by saying he's "better than marbleympics"
    but like yolo's team didnt even vote fen in that game
    i didnt comb over that thread to see if they hard sr'd fen at any point but like
    the "better than marbleympics" statement just sounds disingenuous
    also saw a post from them sod2 saying bbm should never have been the vig shot but like
    i didn't see yolo criticizing the shot when amy called for it eod1
    not a good look

    ##Vote YOLOSWAG
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    Completed im having trouble reconciling these last few...

    Quote Originally Posted by YOLOSWAG (#1433)
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1431)
    Quote Originally Posted by YOLOSWAG (#1430)
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1428)
    ok i skimmed thread once, currently partway through a more detailed reread
    first big takeaway is that im more solid on my fen tr
    amy brought up marbleympics as an example of scumfen making wallposts, but i see a distinction between the wallpost fen made there and the one they made this game

    see
    scumfen juices up his posts in marbleympics to make what could have been said in like a few sentences become an essay
    adding meaningless fluff throughout
    fen’s pushes in the marbleympics wallpost also like makes no sense - they were bullshitting imo

    this game’s wallpost is different
    every sentence has a purpose in clearly outlining their thought process
    the vast majority of this content was original, and isnt relying on or bouncing off of other people’s content
    they also dont safetynet their opinions like they did in marbleympics
    overall the two wallposts are very tonally distinct; hard townvibes

    i also dont see why fen’s eod was scummy? its clear fen wasnt paying very close attention to thread due to oog reasons, and they did what they could in getting off dunn
    the athena wagon was a cfd and not based on new information that cropped up either, so like it makes sense that fen didnt feel all that convinced
    the wallpost in this game also put athena as towny so it checks out here too
    if anything, i think scumfen would have hopped on the athena wagon for towncred - hes more than capable of bullshitting a wallpost to “justify” it too

    can someone tell me how to quote posts from other threads so i can put it here as a side by side
    I go back and forth on him. He def feels better than Marble. If he's town that's rough, probably a late game ML if he is.
    you just called fen scummy like 30 minutes ago what
    And last night I gut townread him. I'm having dissonance on him; that post is entertaining a world where he's town.
    im having trouble reconciling these last few posts from you
    you thought fen was townie yesterday
    you currently think fen’s scummy, but not as scummy as fen was in marble
    but you clearly think they’re scummy enough to knock them into scumlean/scumread territory
    i feel like you said fen is better here than in marbleympics just to agree with me
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    Completed you just called fen scummy like 30 minutes ago...

    Quote Originally Posted by YOLOSWAG (#1430)
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#1428)
    ok i skimmed thread once, currently partway through a more detailed reread
    first big takeaway is that im more solid on my fen tr
    amy brought up marbleympics as an example of scumfen making wallposts, but i see a distinction between the wallpost fen made there and the one they made this game

    see
    scumfen juices up his posts in marbleympics to make what could have been said in like a few sentences become an essay
    adding meaningless fluff throughout
    fen’s pushes in the marbleympics wallpost also like makes no sense - they were bullshitting imo

    this game’s wallpost is different
    every sentence has a purpose in clearly outlining their thought process
    the vast majority of this content was original, and isnt relying on or bouncing off of other people’s content
    they also dont safetynet their opinions like they did in marbleympics
    overall the two wallposts are very tonally distinct; hard townvibes

    i also dont see why fen’s eod was scummy? its clear fen wasnt paying very close attention to thread due to oog reasons, and they did what they could in getting off dunn
    the athena wagon was a cfd and not based on new information that cropped up either, so like it makes sense that fen didnt feel all that convinced
    the wallpost in this game also put athena as towny so it checks out here too
    if anything, i think scumfen would have hopped on the athena wagon for towncred - hes more than capable of bullshitting a wallpost to “justify” it too

    can someone tell me how to quote posts from other threads so i can put it here as a side by side
    I go back and forth on him. He def feels better than Marble. If he's town that's rough, probably a late game ML if he is.
    you just called fen scummy like 30 minutes ago what
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    Completed ok i skimmed thread once, currently partway...

    ok i skimmed thread once, currently partway through a more detailed reread
    first big takeaway is that im more solid on my fen tr
    amy brought up marbleympics as an example of scumfen making wallposts, but i see a distinction between the wallpost fen made there and the one they made this game

    see
    scumfen juices up his posts in marbleympics to make what could have been said in like a few sentences become an essay
    adding meaningless fluff throughout
    fen’s pushes in the marbleympics wallpost also like makes no sense - they were bullshitting imo

    this game’s wallpost is different
    every sentence has a purpose in clearly outlining their thought process
    the vast majority of this content was original, and isnt relying on or bouncing off of other people’s content
    they also dont safetynet their opinions like they did in marbleympics
    overall the two wallposts are very tonally distinct; hard townvibes

    i also dont see why fen’s eod was scummy? its clear fen wasnt paying very close attention to thread due to oog reasons, and they did what they could in getting off dunn
    the athena wagon was a cfd and not based on new information that cropped up either, so like it makes sense that fen didnt feel all that convinced
    the wallpost in this game also put athena as towny so it checks out here too
    if anything, i think scumfen would have hopped on the athena wagon for towncred - hes more than capable of bullshitting a wallpost to “justify” it too

    can someone tell me how to quote posts from other threads so i can put it here as a side by side
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    Completed o ya this i didnt see your flurry of posts...

    Quote Originally Posted by Shinori (#556)
    You know I just lose a lack of drive to post and provide content when my first case gets partially hand-waved or ignored by players without reasoning posted.

    Makaze is scum, dunn's not that great but I'd lynch elsewhere. Not a fan of FJP #452 and #454 where it seems like in 452 they are waffling on both of us and then quick transitions on post 454 into not as much waffling on me with no content inbetween the two posts which is weird.

    I'm not sold on scum claire. Ampharos is on my watch list to an extent.
    o ya this
    i didnt see your flurry of posts before i made the long post about you/makaze and athena
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    Completed is anyone awake

    is anyone awake
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    Completed i skimmed thread during nightphase but tbh i need...

    i skimmed thread during nightphase but tbh i need to reread
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    Completed peabody conservatory

    peabody conservatory
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    Completed jay

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    Completed eff

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    Completed read shinori’s iso the makaze case they’re...

    read shinori’s iso

    the makaze case they’re pushing is like
    tonally 1000000% town
    and point 4 in that wall is especially a big vibe
    i still dont agree with the whole “make content before you get pushed” thing cuz like
    its not like players choose when they get pushed
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    Completed ok fully caught up re: makaze - in the post i...

    ok fully caught up
    re: makaze - in the post i quoted earlier + the next few posts its obvious they’re actively looking for aggressivity in chelsea, even though chelsea’s subsequent posts (or the ones before) arent really even all that aggressive
    just has some words and phrases that can be taken as aggressive in a vacuum
    its like they’re only looking for things that corroborate their chelsea read and disregarding everything else
    but
    i think makaze’s push on shinori’s vote derp is whatever, and if anything i dont see the walkback as scummy
    readslist (save for the vague doubledown on chelsea) doesnt seem like a pile of bull$%#! either
    shinori brushing off the readslist is also a bad look
    at the very least the interaction between makaze/shinori doesnt seem like scumscum
    and makaze is either town on a bad tunnel on chelsea or scum trying to find an easy miselim
    and failing
    idk which is true
    meh

    chelsea’s nonchalance regarding the whole matter is super towny tho

    re: athena - +1 to what others have said regarding the vote + nonpush + unvote on mackc2
    but also like
    what kind of town player goes and says “just answer only to what i asked”
    even though mack’s posts were a clear attempt at gamesolving and is at least tangentially relevant to the discussion at hand
    this is tonally distinct from how town would’ve prodded mack to answer the question
    ##Vote Athena_57
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    Completed hwat kind of post is this

    Quote Originally Posted by Athena_57 (#331)
    @mackc2 fyi I'm less interested in whether u agree with the votes and more if u think the pushes are genuine or not
    hwat kind of post is this
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    Completed me too this oost is the definition of useless

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#196)
    Quote Originally Posted by Chelsea (#189)
    What a waste of my time. Let's move on to something more productive, this will just lead to useless banter.
    ##Vote fairyjigglypuff
    wait i love useless banter
    me too

    this oost is the definition of useless
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    Completed its like you found a few thorny words in her...

    Quote Originally Posted by Makaze (#164)
    Quote Originally Posted by Chelsea (#77)
    Quote Originally Posted by Paperblade (#75)
    i'm not reading posts over three sentences long
    Your posts suck.
    This plus the above posts are pretty heavily pinging to me.

    Chelsea has this weird negativity and aggression that isn't related to scumhunting and doesn't lead to anything. She's leaving herself all of the options and hiding behind a devil may care attitude. I do see the irony in me saying this, but I do try to state my reads, if not my reasons.

    I'd like to hear what @supa2 thinks, if Chelsea won't answer her side.
    its like you found a few thorny words in her posts and then bullshitted a push based on just that, without actually reading her posts in its entirety
    idt town does thay
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    Completed yo man that hurts my feelings

    Quote Originally Posted by supa2 (#126)
    FJP looked like that person in a circle of friends who repeats the same joke someone said 5 minutes ago
    yo man that hurts my feelings
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    Completed time to backread

    time to backread
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    Completed yo freddie j prinze here bout to hit u with the...

    yo freddie j prinze here bout to hit u with the finest of d-tier jokes
    my son freddie j prinze jr voiced fred jones p in scooby doo so take that
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    Completed its called playermeta

    Quote Originally Posted by Chelsea (#80)
    I am fine with allowing fenrir to join my listing of loyal arrancar. But not because I trust Amy and FJP's words. Well, in the way they're trying to show them. You see, friends are often more keen to deception from the people they trust the mouth. I believe both parties would be aware of this fact. So to so easily call one of their own town? Well that is odd. It's either a strong theory that they're correct and fenrir truly is that obvious. Or one of Amy and FJP has information we don't and they're being kind enough to share.
    its called playermeta
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    Completed i would also like to add here that im liking...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#72)
    i think fenrir's displaying this like

    legitimate excitement to be playing the game that i don't think i've necessarily ever seen from him when he rands wolf

    could be a product of the playerlist, but

    we'll see how it goes
    i would also like to add here that im liking fen’s tone
    doesnt have that awkward verboseness that they’re usually prone to having
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    Completed LOL

    Quote Originally Posted by Dunnstral (#71)
    Quote Originally Posted by Chelsea (#56)
    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#54)
    Quote Originally Posted by supa2 (#51)
    For me personally if someone is voting me I assume they are either feeling me or out or they're plotting my demise, and depending on what is said I figure it out after

    Just thought it was strange that before Dunn could even continue you were just like 'yep dunn's town'
    i think in general the ways that villagers and wolves form earlygame reads, especially earlygame wolfreads, are pretty distinct from each other

    and i think i'm fairly decent at telling the two apart
    A naive and cocky opinion. But one town is more likely to make than a sheepish wolf. I suppose you are worthy to survive day 1 for the time being.
    No it's clear what it going on here and this will unmistakably be considered pestilential by some of my peers. Nonetheless, it must be stated that Ampharos has taken it upon herself to keep us hypnotized so we don't deliver new information about her closed-minded, iracund play. Without going into all the gory details, let's just say that she wants to produce an army of mindless insects who will obey her every command. To produce such an army, Ampharos plans to destroy people's minds using either deflection or an advanced form of hypnosis. Whichever approach she takes, she keeps repeating over and over again that she has the experience, ideas, leadership, and integrity to lead us to victory. This verbigeration is symptomatic of an excessive love of fainéantism and indicates to me that someone once told me that Ampharos's modus operandi represents a bastion of hostility toward many people's posting style, play, and opinions. Well, that's true. It's correct. It's how things really are. It would be helpful, however, to add that if you hear Ampharos spouting off about how the average poster can't see through her chicanery, you should tell her that there is no aspect of her malicious, batty beliefs (as I would certainly not call them logically reasoned arguments) that one could reasonably call a redeeming feature. Better yet, tell her to stop getting her opinions from aberrant wonks and start doing some research of her own.
    LOL
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    Completed very true the anime didnt even get to finish

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#65)
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#64)
    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#50)
    Quote Originally Posted by Fenrir (#48)
    Okay wait is the Discord still a thing? If so I either got kicked from it or left and don't remember doing so

    i don't know who aizen is tbh

    yolo is lock swag
    Claire's anonymous account in that one game where everyone had to submit a character and I watched the first 8 episodes of a mech anime (iirc that's what it was) so I could submit Kamina for my character, and it was extremely embarassing so that's all ima say about that.

    Vibe checks loading.
    ...bro have you really not seen gurren lagann
    says the person who hasnt watched bleach lmoa
    yeah bleach has like a billion episodes

    who has time for that
    very true
    the anime didnt even get to finish
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    Completed oh my god your aizen impression is on p o i n t

    Quote Originally Posted by Chelsea (#66)
    Quote Originally Posted by supa2 (#63)
    I have a secret vote but I don't know who to share it with
    Secrets are best kept secrets because of the unknown. You should only share such info if you see an advantage in doing so.
    oh my god your aizen impression is on p o i n t
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    Completed says the person who hasnt watched bleach lmoa

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#50)
    Quote Originally Posted by Fenrir (#48)
    Quote Originally Posted by ariadne (#38)
    ##Vote Makaze

    kill the mods

    dunn voted me because i complained in discord someone was going to say i wasn't playing to my meta after not playing for 5 years we haven't even played before dunn. rude
    Okay wait is the Discord still a thing? If so I either got kicked from it or left and don't remember doing so

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#39)
    i don't know who aizen is tbh

    yolo is lock swag
    Claire's anonymous account in that one game where everyone had to submit a character and I watched the first 8 episodes of a mech anime (iirc that's what it was) so I could submit Kamina for my character, and it was extremely embarassing so that's all ima say about that.

    Vibe checks loading.
    ...bro have you really not seen gurren lagann
    says the person who hasnt watched bleach lmoa
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    Completed nice omgus

    Quote Originally Posted by Dunnstral (#41)
    ##Vote Ampharos

    way too eager to blend in
    nice omgus
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    Completed lmao fair but aizen was grimy af even as he...

    Quote Originally Posted by Chelsea (#35)
    Quote Originally Posted by fairyjigglypuff (#33)
    Quote Originally Posted by Chelsea (#32)
    I figured since one of my favorite games on our lovely site was my win as Aizen it would be...fitting to bring him back! So my posts will be mixed in along with that style starting from here on out.

    Let's have fun shall we?
    aizen is a villain tho
    That, is a matter of perspective my friend.
    lmao fair
    but aizen was grimy af even as he manhandled juhabach
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    Completed s w a g

    Quote Originally Posted by YOLOSWAG (#34)
    Good evening fine ladies and gentlemen (and Claire) of Serenesforest. As cute as all this banter is, let's get straight to the point.

    ##Vote Makaze

    I have reread the game on several occasions, ran an ISO of each player no less than ten times, and every time I do so from an objective standpoint it is self-evident that we have no choice but to kill Makaze. I didn't want to go down this path considering the last time I played with him we thunderdomed for 200+ pages, but objectivity leaves me no choice but to conclude that he's scum.

    I expect everyone to come in here and, perhaps, $%#!post a little or "gamesolve." That's all well and good. If that's what people want and need to do convince themselves that they're professional mafia players who are approaching the game in a proper and academic way, then more power to them. But at the end of the day, we all know what we're here for, and that's to ensure Makaze is today's elimination due to his multitude of scummy posts leaving no choice but to kill him.

    Afterwards, we will be clapping Claire and vigging Amphy in that order, followed by a Shinori lunch, all of whom have been making some extremely scummy af posts thus far.

    Thank you in advance for your understanding and assistance in today's elimination.
    s w a g
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    Completed aizen is a villain tho

    Quote Originally Posted by Chelsea (#32)
    I figured since one of my favorite games on our lovely site was my win as Aizen it would be...fitting to bring him back! So my posts will be mixed in along with that style starting from here on out.

    Let's have fun shall we?
    aizen is a villain tho
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    Completed damn height discrimination be real

    damn height discrimination be real
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    Completed AND IM ONLY 5’7 ON A GOOD DAY

    AND IM ONLY 5’7 ON A GOOD DAY
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    Completed WHO SAYS SHORT PEOPLE CANT BECOME STORMTROOPERS...

    WHO SAYS SHORT PEOPLE CANT BECOME STORMTROOPERS
    I ASPIRE TO BE A JET TROOPER SOME DAY
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    Completed aaaaaaa so many names i recognize from eimm que...

    aaaaaaa so many names i recognize from eimm
    que divertido
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