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Thread: QuickTopic shutting down soon

  1. ISO #1
    Bandwagoner leetic's Avatar
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    QuickTopic shutting down soon

    Sadly, it's shutting down December 11 of this year: https://www.quicktopic.com/qt-shutdown.shtml

    While most of the mafia world has long moved on to Discord, I'll have to admit that I will miss QuickTopic. The thing I liked the most about it was that it was the best option for archiving old scum/deadchats. There are games I played many years ago and can still access the QTs of them many years later, and anyone else can still access them as long as they once clicked the link. Discord is not nearly as good for such archival, and with many abandoned servers/accounts/chats, there are many mafia games that are simply lost to the internet, and much of what is still on there is inaccessible due to expired links and might not remain for longer. Sadly, QuickTopic threads are now going the same way, so I'd recommend archiving all your QuickTopic threads before they are lost to history: https://web.archive.org/

    I think it's worth a conversation on how Mafia games should be properly archived. Since I lost access to my leetic account on Bulbagarden for instance, I no longer have access to the dead and scum chats for the US Presidential Election mafia game that I hosted there as they were held over private messages, and there are many Discord servers for scumchats and deadchats in games I played that either no longer exist or that I can no longer access due to an expired link. Public forums may not last forever either, though Web Archive can help in that situation. Do you have any ideas on how games can be better preserved in the future?

  2. ISO #2
    Galaxy Brain Shad's Avatar
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    That's a shame.

    A lot of these legacy sites die to no one having the interest to continue to finance them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Panther
    I thought you were a nerd last week but then I saw you say you play golf and remember you said you chewed so you're some kind of unicorn or something

  3. ISO #3
    1610 roro__b's Avatar Moderator
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    Aww i have so many threads from 2013-2017 games it's gonna take ages to save it all


    thanks for posting this, i wouldn't have noticed
    1610

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    Penalty Box Syn's Avatar
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    imagine wanting to remember anything related to mafia

  5. ISO #5
    Thread Analyst Kaiveran's Avatar
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    This well and truly sucks, not only for the historical aspect, but for the fact that QTs are the only thing that could hold a candle to contemporary private chats/channels that could be easily anonymized. I played several games in the past (and had a game concept in the making) that used this capability in a creative manner, and now I don't know how it's gonna happen again.

    Unfortunately, to bounce off Shad's reply; we were living through one of the greatest levels of inequality in history before the pandemic. That just turned the Amazon Basics MoneyVacs up to 11. I can't imagine that the people who ran QuickTopic were very wealthy to begin with, and with both the ravages of time and the boundless expansion of the site, something had to give eventually. And of course, nobody on the other side of this coin gives a $%#!; they just wanna see ~number go up~.

    The more this squeeze happens, the more MafiaWolf communities and tools are reliant on the patronage of a small group of (relatively) well-off people – and fortunes can still turn in an instant. Of course, you could make the argument that this has always been the case to some degree (and QT had use cases well beyond the game), but before, when the original patrons lost interest or funding, there was a good chance that someone could step up and replace them. Looking back, there seems to be a clear divide pre- vs post-Great-Recession; sites that had some sort of leadership and/or financial crisis before then tended to survive, while those dealing with it after trend towards going under. I can only guess the attrition rate has suffered another marked increase by now.
    When developing my own concept for a general open-source framework for MafiaWolf communities (and severely underestimating the level of expertise needed to make it happen ) I did come up with the idea of integrating a sort of messenger/chat suite within the framework itself – which would not only be unique to each site that used it, and include features like anonymization and scheduling per-venue, but also be integrated and accessible within the game thread post-game, so you could see with unprecedented clarity exactly how things went down in that game. It seems like I have to learn quite a bit of coding languages and skills to actually do this, though, and every time I attempt to do so it's like banging my head against a brick wall.

    Even if I did "get started early" enough (or linked with enough knowledgeable people) to make this framework a reality by now, it still wouldn't solve the core issue: money. In itself, no amount of coding wizardry or community engagement is going to pay for the additional server space and hosting fees a site will inevitably need once the data starts piling up. I don't think we can rely on any suspiciously wealthy benefactors to save us either; the upper-class culture right now is just one step short of flying garish "GREED IS GOOD" banners from every skyscraper. I don't think subscription models work either, and when trivializing attitudes like Syn's exist, the argument that the history and development of the game is important to archive in the first place may fall on deaf ears.

    With something as big as QT probably too heavy a financial boulder to ever push back up the hill, so to speak, Patreon/donations/crowdfunding/etc. on a small per-community basis seems to be the best we can do right now. I'd love to be proven wrong, though. Perhaps we could make an active push to network with other extant communities, maybe starting to pool these individual funds together, and start to build a truly inter-community archival effort from there?

  6. ISO #6
    Penalty Box Syn's Avatar
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    I don't think wanting the mafia community to unionize and pool its collective funds just to fund in-perpetuity chat archiving is a realistic or reasonable position when you can just save the chats you want to remember yourself.

    You say my attitude trivializes, but I ensure I host every private chat on Discord with a separate account dedicated solely to keeping those servers open long after I've left them with my personal account, and I ensure that all invite links are set to permanent. I haven't seen another host who offers that much chat longevity since the switch to Discord.

  7. ISO #7
    Thread Analyst Kaiveran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syn (#6)
    You say my attitude trivializes, but I ensure I host every private chat on Discord with a separate account dedicated solely to keeping those servers open long after I've left them with my personal account, and I ensure that all invite links are set to permanent. I haven't seen another host who offers that much chat longevity since the switch to Discord.
    Actually, I've done much the same, except I've just stayed in the servers myself and kept them in a special folder instead of using an alt.

    Perhaps I judged you too harshly...

    Still, all this assumes that Discord will be around for a long time, and/or will have an archiver-friendly closing process. Given the recent NFT debacle, and the subsequent cancellation of Nitro subs en masse, I've started to have doubts.

    (This is another one of the pitfalls of overly centralized patronage; sometimes the guy in charge does dumb $%#!, and challenging them on said dumb $%#! can sometimes jeopardize the entire thing.)

    I understand my biases: namely that my passion for the game is unusual, and I've been bitten by home communities collapsing several times. So I may be overly pessimistic/wonky.

    Still, I think if this game means even half as much to other players and hosts as it does to me, it's worth thinking about how we can make its communities and its history more resilient.
    Last edited by Kaiveran; November 22nd, 2021 at 07:25 PM.

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