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Thread: Return of the Ultralight

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  1. ISO #101
    Soul Reader The Penguin's Avatar
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    Rip the formatting

  2. ISO #102
    hi

    i'm probably gonna take into account the captain thing a least somewhat. not necessarily like, trying to figure out who some specific people are gonna pick or start wifoming about "did they pick the obvious choice or did they take someone less obvious"
    but i think that overall ppl who are generally lhf / people who no one knows are less likely to have been picked, completely regardless of who the captain is


    i did have some townpings from p#15 mostly because of the "lmao", but this is probably just stupid read lol

    p#17 does feel somewhat towny to me. kinda because of wisdom just openly calling themselves the most obvious pick etc, and i think if they were wolf they'd probably want to be somewhat more quiet about that (this is probably a bad reason lol). and also bc that immediately starting to go in circles about "who would pick whom" seems like a towny thought process lol

    numka was somewhat towny. i did like p#73 just because of them being annoyed at meta lol. also just vibes overall, they seem somewhat relaxed which might be towny

    dont really see ichigo as wolfy. my initial impression of their opening was that it was better than in their last scumgame, but i don't think its actually out of their scumrange or anything, so its whatever i guess. i don't think they've done anything wolfy, though
    (also i now realized that actually only skumbag is scumreading ichigo, but it was the latest post i had read so i somehow thought ichigo was more consensus scumread lmao)

    also i liked p#77 (and just the active approach overall) from skumbag. just because that's being actively pro-town. (which doesnt always mean they're actually town, but whatever, that's good enough for now lmao)

  3. ISO #103
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    Just reread Valentine and it looks like they backpedaled about the meaning of tepid:

    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#55)
    also, i am gently encouraging people to vote vivax with me. wagons are good.
    Vivax had not posted again before this post, but Valentine is trying to get a wagon on them? That seems to much just for pressure on a null read.

  4. ISO #104
    No Hesitation Cape90's Avatar
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    P#70 - I don't think people self metaing themselves is really all that alignment indicative. I hardly find wolves using self-meta as a crutch anyways if that's a concern . Though I am concerned a lot of Wisdom's recent content has revolved around such talk.

    I think Swedish is town for P#68 and some of the work/observations he made there. I liked the Valentine thing, I did not notice the whole ping comment before.

    I don't like Egix's question proposed at Swedish in P#79 since Swedish answered this in P#69 at the bottom, just briefly.

    ##Unvote Vivax
    P#74 - I liked the analysis post that Vivax gave on Zugzwang/SwedishSkumbag and specifically pointing out Numka as not finding their opening odd, probably harkening back to P#40 from Numka

  5. ISO #105
    No Hesitation Cape90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#71)
    oh, that might be my thoughts being... weird. ping to me is overtly scummy or towny, tepid is... neutral ground and i didn’t qualify it as either/or. it’s something to poke at and draw blood from though.

    i’ll try to be clearer with my thoughts with words like that since my associations verbally can be um. weird to say the least at times.
    If it was so neutral to you, why were you pushing the slot then in the first place?

  6. ISO #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#104)
    P#70 - I don't think people self metaing themselves is really all that alignment indicative. I hardly find wolves using self-meta as a crutch anyways if that's a concern . Though I am concerned a lot of Wisdom's recent content has revolved around such talk.

    I think Swedish is town for P#68 and some of the work/observations he made there. I liked the Valentine thing, I did not notice the whole ping comment before.

    I don't like Egix's question proposed at Swedish in P#79 since Swedish answered this in P#69 at the bottom, just briefly.

    ##Unvote Vivax
    P#74 - I liked the analysis post that Vivax gave on Zugzwang/SwedishSkumbag and specifically pointing out Numka as not finding their opening odd, probably harkening back to P#40 from Numka
    So
    If you don't think self meta is scummy then why are you concerned that wisdom talked a lot about it?

  7. ISO #107
    Thread Analyst zergon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Penguin (#99)
    Cape90
    --------------------------------
    P#65 has a bit of a weird spot, regarding niph and beagle, feels a bit forced to add there, tbh.
    Otherwise has quite similar thoughts as me.
    @The Penguin why Cape is at bottom of your read list when you say here that he´s thoughts are mostly similar to yours?

  8. ISO #108
    Thread Analyst Valentine's Avatar
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    ...do people here not push null reads to help sort? that’s pretty normal from my experiences.

  9. ISO #109
    No Hesitation Cape90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#106)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#104)
    P#70 - I don't think people self metaing themselves is really all that alignment indicative. I hardly find wolves using self-meta as a crutch anyways if that's a concern . Though I am concerned a lot of Wisdom's recent content has revolved around such talk.

    I think Swedish is town for P#68 and some of the work/observations he made there. I liked the Valentine thing, I did not notice the whole ping comment before.

    I don't like Egix's question proposed at Swedish in P#79 since Swedish answered this in P#69 at the bottom, just briefly.

    ##Unvote Vivax
    P#74 - I liked the analysis post that Vivax gave on Zugzwang/SwedishSkumbag and specifically pointing out Numka as not finding their opening odd, probably harkening back to P#40 from Numka
    So
    If you don't think self meta is scummy then why are you concerned that wisdom talked a lot about it?
    It's more they have talked about it quite a bit in several (not exactly self-meta but point stands) different posts versus the content of there being self meta in Wisdom's posts. A lot of the talk feels LAMIST and unproductive

  10. ISO #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#108)
    ...do people here not push null reads to help sort? that’s pretty normal from my experiences.
    Pushing them is one thing
    Trying to get a wagon on them seems too much to me tho
    Like, scum!you could just continue pushing them, and the wagon will probably have enough momentum to be a major wagon at eod

    Also Idk about site meta I'm new here too

    Anyway I haven't had anything from vivax ping me but I should probably take a closer look at them tho

  11. ISO #111
    Automatic Game Mod Mafia Host's Avatar
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    Return of the Ultralight Day 1 Votecount

    Votes Target Voters (Posts in Phase)
    3 Wisdom niphredil (2), Numka (7), Zugzwang (6)
    1 Vivax Valentine (16)
    1 Beagle Egix96 (3)
    1 Zugzwang Vivax (4)
    1 Kurosaki Ichigo SwedishSkumbag (17)
    1 Egix96 The Penguin (16)
    7 Not voting aphelios (0), Scipio1 (3), Wisdom (6), zergon (10), Beagle (1), Kurosaki Ichigo (2), Cape90 (8)

    View Vote History

    Day 1 ends at 9:00 PM EDT on Thursday, June 9th, 2022. There are 1654822860000 remaining.

  12. ISO #112
    Galaxy Brain SwedishSkumbag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Penguin (#99)
    Egix96
    --------------------------------
    Complete opposite read from the same lines compared to Swedish, but less of an explantion for it. I dont think they are partnered atm.
    can you talk about a little about this? I'm not sure i understand exactly what you're referncing (even if i have a guess)

    And then talk about how this lead to Egix landing in your wolfleans (or if it wasn't this particular thing, then what was it)

    @The Penguin

  13. ISO #113
    Galaxy Brain SwedishSkumbag's Avatar
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    ##Vote Valentine

    actually, this vote feel more interesting currently

  14. ISO #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#109)
    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#106)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#104)
    P#70 - I don't think people self metaing themselves is really all that alignment indicative. I hardly find wolves using self-meta as a crutch anyways if that's a concern . Though I am concerned a lot of Wisdom's recent content has revolved around such talk.

    I think Swedish is town for P#68 and some of the work/observations he made there. I liked the Valentine thing, I did not notice the whole ping comment before.

    I don't like Egix's question proposed at Swedish in P#79 since Swedish answered this in P#69 at the bottom, just briefly.

    ##Unvote Vivax
    P#74 - I liked the analysis post that Vivax gave on Zugzwang/SwedishSkumbag and specifically pointing out Numka as not finding their opening odd, probably harkening back to P#40 from Numka
    So
    If you don't think self meta is scummy then why are you concerned that wisdom talked a lot about it?
    It's more they have talked about it quite a bit in several (not exactly self-meta but point stands) different posts versus the content of there being self meta in Wisdom's posts. A lot of the talk feels LAMIST and unproductive
    So
    You're saying it's not the self meta itself. but the productive things that it is replacing?

  15. ISO #115
    Thread Analyst Valentine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#110)
    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#108)
    ...do people here not push null reads to help sort? that’s pretty normal from my experiences.
    Pushing them is one thing
    Trying to get a wagon on them seems too much to me tho
    Like, scum!you could just continue pushing them, and the wagon will probably have enough momentum to be a major wagon at eod

    Also Idk about site meta I'm new here too

    Anyway I haven't had anything from vivax ping me but I should probably take a closer look at them tho

    this is for you as well as @Cape90

    do you think that a wagon started on page one off of what even i describe as something not really mafiaish is the basis for a wagon that goes through at the end of the day without critical analysis? it’s early on but you’re both engaging with this now and i’m wondering... do you actually think that, given the posts so far, vivax would have come anywhere close to an actual elimination? (for posterity i’m going to move my vote but i’m unsure where now.)

    it seems... off to me to shade me i guess for pushing vivax as if i wanted to kill him when it’s this early on. maybe it’s culture difference where this sort of thing happens almost every single game but... what do you think i gain from this if i’m mafia?

  16. ISO #116
    Thread Analyst zergon's Avatar
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    Right, lets give this a try. Fair word of caution before you continue reading. I have pretty bad track record on day solving and typically have at least one wolf on my top town spots so take anything I say with grain of salt.

    town lean:
    SwedishSkumbag Kind of a fluffy start but got going pretty quickly. I disagree with most of the read list on post #80 but I find that a good thing and is able to justify those reads. Seems to have somewhat differend reads from most of the rest of us and that makes me think he´s town as I feel wolf´s wold be more likely to make reads that fit bit more into general consensus.
    The Penguin: Asking questions and giving reads which is typically easy way to get town points fron me. Seemed to be the one who is most active to move the game forward at start of day 1 (bit unfair to some who weren´t around perhaps but still). Mostly agree or at least could see were the reads come on his read list. Cape being at the bottom is a bit odd considering he pointed Cape has similar reads than him.

    light town lean:
    Cape90 first to give any kind of read (post #15). Is mostly going after low posters on post
    #65 which feels a bit like path of least resistance but otherwise decent tone and content so far (plus as someone who often go against low posters myself, it´s not something I can judge too much). I do like him pointing out what on Wisdom´s post #17 pinged him compered to what I said about that post.
    Kurosaki Ichigo: Asked early questions and gave early reads which is always a plus on my books. Need to see more activity before I´m willing to put him further but so far I haven´t seen anything that pings me from him.

  17. ISO #117
    No Hesitation Cape90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#114)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#109)
    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#106)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#104)
    P#70 - I don't think people self metaing themselves is really all that alignment indicative. I hardly find wolves using self-meta as a crutch anyways if that's a concern . Though I am concerned a lot of Wisdom's recent content has revolved around such talk.

    I think Swedish is town for P#68 and some of the work/observations he made there. I liked the Valentine thing, I did not notice the whole ping comment before.

    I don't like Egix's question proposed at Swedish in P#79 since Swedish answered this in P#69 at the bottom, just briefly.

    ##Unvote Vivax
    P#74 - I liked the analysis post that Vivax gave on Zugzwang/SwedishSkumbag and specifically pointing out Numka as not finding their opening odd, probably harkening back to P#40 from Numka
    So
    If you don't think self meta is scummy then why are you concerned that wisdom talked a lot about it?
    It's more they have talked about it quite a bit in several (not exactly self-meta but point stands) different posts versus the content of there being self meta in Wisdom's posts. A lot of the talk feels LAMIST and unproductive
    So
    You're saying it's not the self meta itself. but the productive things that it is replacing?
    I don't know what you mean

    I was more, it seemed excessive from Wisdom's end. But it could be a playstyle thing since they reference meta reads being easier for them to rely on

  18. ISO #118
    Thread Analyst zergon's Avatar
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    neutral:
    Zugzwang: Kind of like the two posts he had so far. Post #42 tries to start conversation, I get Vivax case on it being something wolves could do to look busy but the way I see it, any conversation gives chance to information, disagreement etc. which could lead into more conversation and potentially somewhere around the line there´s useful information to have. I don´ hate his case on Wisdom but feel that it´s mostly about differend playstyle/worldview than actual wolf case. Kind of waving if I should but Zugzwang on light town leans or neutrals, I think Vivax´s point slips it to neutral until I see more.

    Wisdom: I did like post #13 (for the usual early content reasons) but post #17 pinged me a bit as it´s basically just saying "I´m town". Disagree with Egix thread spewed town logic at post #45 as only Cape and Kuro did say he felt town. Read on me is tone based (it´s NAI by the way, I´m just build that way) and thus easy to walk back on but it´s early read none the less and you likely know at this point how I feel about those. Overall, general posting style makes me read them as town but I know better than just trust my general feeling and content probably states neutral right now.

    Vivax: Somewhat defensive on post #57 although there´s a point there as well (first post don´t need to be productive). I don´t hate his case on Zugzwang as I do see the logic behind it on post #72. Some other interesting thoughts as well like pointing out that Numka reacted to his opening post differently than other´s (not finding it odd versus Cape and Valentine finding it odd).

  19. ISO #119
    Automatic Game Mod Mafia Host's Avatar
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    Return of the Ultralight Day 1 Votecount

    Votes Target Voters (Posts in Phase)
    3 Wisdom niphredil (2), Numka (7), Zugzwang (7)
    1 Vivax Valentine (17)
    1 Beagle Egix96 (3)
    1 Zugzwang Vivax (4)
    1 Egix96 The Penguin (16)
    1 Valentine SwedishSkumbag (19)
    7 Not voting aphelios (0), Scipio1 (3), Wisdom (6), zergon (12), Beagle (1), Kurosaki Ichigo (2), Cape90 (9)

    View Vote History

    Day 1 ends at 9:00 PM EDT on Thursday, June 9th, 2022. There are 1654822860000 remaining.

  20. ISO #120
    Soul Reader Vivax's Avatar
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    #5

    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#110)
    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#108)
    ...do people here not push null reads to help sort? that’s pretty normal from my experiences.
    Pushing them is one thing
    Trying to get a wagon on them seems too much to me tho
    Like, scum!you could just continue pushing them, and the wagon will probably have enough momentum to be a major wagon at eod

    Also Idk about site meta I'm new here too

    Anyway I haven't had anything from vivax ping me but I should probably take a closer look at them tho
    Phoneposting so i‘ll keep it brief.

    I thought you had a plan for everyone to say who the mafia would be based on what a captain would choose.

    Why didn‘t you follow up on your own suggestion?

  21. ISO #121
    Thread Analyst zergon's Avatar
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    Valentine: early reads on post #33, shot down Zugzwang´s conversation attemp on post #43 which lightly pinged me. I do get the logic why they feels that way but any conversation is better than none so trying to kill conversation feels wolfy to me. I don´t hate the early Vivax vote considering it´s page one vote with actual reasoning. Post #54 feels odd reasoning (putting more stock on how wolves could have be chosen later rather than now). Thinking that kind off talk would be better to do early to start generating content rather than later when there´s more stuff to look at. Saying SwedishScumbag is second suspect on post #95 feels a bid odd considering that it´s the read list that they state as a reason (yes, it´s shallow but not any more than their push on Vivax that they said there were invested on so kind of odd reason to wolf read player). Vivax push died kind of quickly and somewhat hesitant to give any reads on post #95. Overall, quite a mixed pack so far.

    Egix96: I can see the point Kuro and Cape made on post #11 feeling towny but don´t really agree, to me it´s NAI. Post #62 is mixed pack to me, I do agree the read given on Kuro, but going after Beagle feels bit early with exactly one post. Answer to Zugwang feels a bit like trying to shut conversation down but it´s stated on a way that makes it feel more like an opinion to me. Overall, some pings but probably overall slight town hence slighly above nulls.

    niphredil: Post #102, I agree on Kuro, and Cape. Disagree on Numka towny read (and Wisdom but I see the logic there). Need to see bit more before deciding were to go with this spot.

    aphelios: no content

    Beagle: No real content yet, going to wait a bit to see more before making judgement here.

  22. ISO #122
    Thread Analyst zergon's Avatar
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    pinging a bit:
    Scipio1: Post #34 feels like it´s made to kill the discussion. Might be just making his opinion clear though. Post #35 is slight positive (again, early read given) even if I feel it was already pretty safe read to make at that point.

    Numka: Post #36 feels bit odd to point out with reasoning already given before. Post #40 feels like it slighly trying to discredit Vivax push. Post #73 feels like potential excuse on not having many reads as only read so far is Penguin -> town which I agree but it feels kind of safe read to make (assuming that Wisdom vote ain´t serious, if it is then that´s a second read)

  23. ISO #123
    Thread Analyst Beagle's Avatar
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    town

  24. ISO #124
    Thread Analyst zergon's Avatar
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    Right, so that read list got all over the place. Here´s post numbers:

    Town leans: #116

    neutral part 1: #118

    neutral part2: #121

    pinging: #122

    Putting my vote on here for now:
    ##Vote Numka

  25. ISO #125
    Galaxy Brain SwedishSkumbag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zergon (#121)
    Valentine: early reads on post #33, shot down Zugzwang´s conversation attemp on post #43 which lightly pinged me. I do get the logic why they feels that way but any conversation is better than none so trying to kill conversation feels wolfy to me. I don´t hate the early Vivax vote considering it´s page one vote with actual reasoning. Post #54 feels odd reasoning (putting more stock on how wolves could have be chosen later rather than now). Thinking that kind off talk would be better to do early to start generating content rather than later when there´s more stuff to look at. Saying SwedishScumbag is second suspect on post #95 feels a bid odd considering that it´s the read list that they state as a reason (yes, it´s shallow but not any more than their push on Vivax that they said there were invested on so kind of odd reason to wolf read player). Vivax push died kind of quickly and somewhat hesitant to give any reads on post #95. Overall, quite a mixed pack so far.
    Considering that the part that i bolded here is the only part that should possibly be viewed as positive, i'm a little surprised you ended at "a mixed pack" tbh

    thoughts?

  26. ISO #126
    No Hesitation Cape90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#115)
    do you think that a wagon started on page one off of what even i describe as something not really mafiaish is the basis for a wagon that goes through at the end of the day without critical analysis?
    No I do not think without critical analysis, a push like that goes through by the end of the day. I was thinking that you were pushing on more then a neutral read, which is where my comment came from. But I don't see a point in pursuing a push I am not feeling anymore, didn't feel mafia vibes from Vivax from their latest postings, so I am not pushing there right now, and why should I?

    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#115)
    do you actually think that, given the posts so far, vivax would have come anywhere close to an actual elimination?
    Never was worried about this since there is no majority today, it is day 1.

    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#115)
    it seems... off to me to shade me i guess for pushing vivax as if i wanted to kill him when it’s this early on
    I know this part was directed at Zugzwang, but my comment wasn't shade in case that needed clearing up

    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#115)
    what do you think i gain from this if i’m mafia?
    I suppose you can make this point, but it seems like a circulatory argument that you could use for just about any early game action that you make.

  27. ISO #127
    Galaxy Brain SwedishSkumbag's Avatar
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    early W/W reads are always a shot in the wind (or whatever a good saying would be), but if zergon/Val are w/w I wouldn't be surprised

  28. ISO #128
    Galaxy Brain SwedishSkumbag's Avatar
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    (i do highly support him giving so much content though, regardless of his alignment)

  29. ISO #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#117)
    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#114)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#109)
    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#106)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#104)
    P#70 - I don't think people self metaing themselves is really all that alignment indicative. I hardly find wolves using self-meta as a crutch anyways if that's a concern . Though I am concerned a lot of Wisdom's recent content has revolved around such talk.

    I think Swedish is town for P#68 and some of the work/observations he made there. I liked the Valentine thing, I did not notice the whole ping comment before.

    I don't like Egix's question proposed at Swedish in P#79 since Swedish answered this in P#69 at the bottom, just briefly.

    ##Unvote Vivax
    P#74 - I liked the analysis post that Vivax gave on Zugzwang/SwedishSkumbag and specifically pointing out Numka as not finding their opening odd, probably harkening back to P#40 from Numka
    So
    If you don't think self meta is scummy then why are you concerned that wisdom talked a lot about it?
    It's more they have talked about it quite a bit in several (not exactly self-meta but point stands) different posts versus the content of there being self meta in Wisdom's posts. A lot of the talk feels LAMIST and unproductive
    So
    You're saying it's not the self meta itself. but the productive things that it is replacing?
    I don't know what you mean

    I was more, it seemed excessive from Wisdom's end. But it could be a playstyle thing since they reference meta reads being easier for them to rely on
    So do you scumread them or not

    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#115)
    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#110)
    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#108)
    ...do people here not push null reads to help sort? that’s pretty normal from my experiences.
    Pushing them is one thing
    Trying to get a wagon on them seems too much to me tho
    Like, scum!you could just continue pushing them, and the wagon will probably have enough momentum to be a major wagon at eod

    Also Idk about site meta I'm new here too

    Anyway I haven't had anything from vivax ping me but I should probably take a closer look at them tho

    this is for you as well as @Cape90

    do you think that a wagon started on page one off of what even i describe as something not really mafiaish is the basis for a wagon that goes through at the end of the day without critical analysis? it’s early on but you’re both engaging with this now and i’m wondering... do you actually think that, given the posts so far, vivax would have come anywhere close to an actual elimination? (for posterity i’m going to move my vote but i’m unsure where now.)

    it seems... off to me to shade me i guess for pushing vivax as if i wanted to kill him when it’s this early on. maybe it’s culture difference where this sort of thing happens almost every single game but... what do you think i gain from this if i’m mafia?
    If you continue pushing them, then yes I could see that plus a wagon on them to be enough to eliminate them

    Obviously you'd add more points to your case as there are more posts, but at least from my experience it's easier to keep a wagon alive than to start it

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivax (#120)
    #5

    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#110)
    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#108)
    ...do people here not push null reads to help sort? that’s pretty normal from my experiences.
    Pushing them is one thing
    Trying to get a wagon on them seems too much to me tho
    Like, scum!you could just continue pushing them, and the wagon will probably have enough momentum to be a major wagon at eod

    Also Idk about site meta I'm new here too

    Anyway I haven't had anything from vivax ping me but I should probably take a closer look at them tho
    Phoneposting so i‘ll keep it brief.

    I thought you had a plan for everyone to say who the mafia would be based on what a captain would choose.

    Why didn‘t you follow up on your own suggestion?
    One thing I was hoping was for someone to give a very detailed answer, because that's scum indicative as the captain may have detailed reasoning already, whereas town likely need to think about it for the first time. I couldn't really get people to talk about it effectively without mentioning something like this, but of course that would ruin it.

    Also before you say this idea is too correct, I was making this stuff before game started, so I had time to make it good.

  30. ISO #130
    Thread Analyst Valentine's Avatar
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    @Cape90 oh. where i usually play it’s always majority even on day one, which was weirding me out more in this situation because it’s like... fearmongering about the scary fast wagon that no one talks about and just sends through wasting a day one. that kind of paranoia is... something mafia likes to weaponize, be the person who slows things down and frets over something getting traction.

    regardless it still feels as if it’s like... my motivations are being framed or were to kill vivax and that is why i was going so hard after him, etc. if i was mafia i do think i’d just characterize my read on him as a scumread rather than a mehread and not have to reiterate it over and over to save myself the headache rather than risk hedging.

    (yes i know this doesn’t do a lot for people, self meta, self speculation; but i don’t know how else i can respond to the circulatory reasoning comment when to me that was the point i guess of what i was saying.)

  31. ISO #131
    Quote Originally Posted by zergon (#121)
    niphredil: Post #102, I agree on Kuro, and Cape. Disagree on Numka towny read (and Wisdom but I see the logic there). Need to see bit more before deciding were to go with this spot.
    (tbh about numka i did have a pre-game thought that "numka probably will be town bc she's been lhf enough in her previous games that she probably isn't getting picked into any wolfteams", and that might affect on why i'm townreading her pretty easily here lmao)

    and tbh i kinda think that a lot of the reasons why people are pushing valentine here are just nitpicking on word choices / playculture differences, rather than anything actually AI
    but also i don't really have a read on valentine so i'm not really opposed to them being pushed atm

  32. ISO #132
    Thread Analyst Valentine's Avatar
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    @Zugzwang do you think that mafia are likely to... pretty arbitrarily pick someone and kill them without like. letting go i guess? just. “this is my person and i want them dead.”

    this might seem petty i think to ask but it’s more trying to understand your experience with stuff.

  33. ISO #133
    Soul Reader The Penguin's Avatar
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    Answers to the questions in P#107 and P#112

    Why cape is at bottom boils down to that the scum leans are not in any particular order, but why they are there is that they have the same reads as me. I dont see that as a positive and that combined with the forced nature, leans them a scumlean.

    The egix thing is from P#62, with no reasoning. That with a vibe lands them as scumlean.

  34. ISO #134
    No Hesitation Cape90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#129)
    So do you scumread them or not
    I'm kinda on the middle right now

    I feel like they could be getting voted for being a scary target for mafia, but then begs the question, if this is true, which of niphredil/Numka/Zugzwang are mafia. I think niph's vote might have been RvS though which does lead into that sort of slippery slope

  35. ISO #135
    Thread Analyst Valentine's Avatar
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    this is perhaps the only game i’ve played in recent memory where i’ve posted this much which is good because i’m actually enjoying playing this game again for once but bad because post limits. which... i joined because i didn’t wanna be overwhelmed. go figure.

    i’ll come back tonight and post no more than 3 times to save posts for tomorrow, but in the meantime if people want to ask me stuff or have me expand on something specific please let me know. other than that i’ll try to give a day one general thoughts and all set of posts.

    until tonight!!!

  36. ISO #136
    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#129)
    One thing I was hoping was for someone to give a very detailed answer, because that's scum indicative as the captain may have detailed reasoning already, whereas town likely need to think about it for the first time. I couldn't really get people to talk about it effectively without mentioning something like this, but of course that would ruin it.

    Also before you say this idea is too correct, I was making this stuff before game started, so I had time to make it good.
    lol that isn't necessarily very good way of reading people, or at least i was thinking about "who would i pick if i rand captain" pre-rand lol, and could give pretty detailed answer to that question even though i'm not a wolf :P

    also that pre-emtipve defense is. weird. but i really cannot tell if it's towny or wolfy here lol

  37. ISO #137
    No Hesitation Cape90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Penguin (#133)
    but why they are there is that they have the same reads as me. I dont see that as a positive
    Why do you not find this a positive from your POV?

  38. ISO #138
    Thread Analyst zergon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwedishSkumbag (#125)
    Quote Originally Posted by zergon (#121)
    Valentine: early reads on post #33, shot down Zugzwang´s conversation attemp on post #43 which lightly pinged me. I do get the logic why they feels that way but any conversation is better than none so trying to kill conversation feels wolfy to me. I don´t hate the early Vivax vote considering it´s page one vote with actual reasoning. Post #54 feels odd reasoning (putting more stock on how wolves could have be chosen later rather than now). Thinking that kind off talk would be better to do early to start generating content rather than later when there´s more stuff to look at. Saying SwedishScumbag is second suspect on post #95 feels a bid odd considering that it´s the read list that they state as a reason (yes, it´s shallow but not any more than their push on Vivax that they said there were invested on so kind of odd reason to wolf read player). Vivax push died kind of quickly and somewhat hesitant to give any reads on post #95. Overall, quite a mixed pack so far.
    Considering that the part that i bolded here is the only part that should possibly be viewed as positive, i'm a little surprised you ended at "a mixed pack" tbh

    thoughts?
    To me early reads is positive (I do come from community who plays role madness games all the time and our day phase solving tends to be bit of a suspect compered to more traditional communities hence why any early reads is an automatic plus from me).

    That said, I do see your point, it kind of reads mostly negatives so perhaps I have them higher than I should. I´m going to rethink that tomorrow to see how I feel about this spot once I mull it over a bit but right now, I feel mixed bag and plamenent on list(think I used wrong word earlier? ) is about right considering I town read them initially (based on early read and start of the Vivax push).

  39. ISO #139
    Soul Reader Vivax's Avatar
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    #6

    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#129)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#117)
    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#114)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#109)
    It's more they have talked about it quite a bit in several (not exactly self-meta but point stands) different posts versus the content of there being self meta in Wisdom's posts. A lot of the talk feels LAMIST and unproductive
    So
    You're saying it's not the self meta itself. but the productive things that it is replacing?
    I don't know what you mean

    I was more, it seemed excessive from Wisdom's end. But it could be a playstyle thing since they reference meta reads being easier for them to rely on
    So do you scumread them or not

    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#115)
    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#110)
    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#108)
    ...do people here not push null reads to help sort? that’s pretty normal from my experiences.
    Pushing them is one thing
    Trying to get a wagon on them seems too much to me tho
    Like, scum!you could just continue pushing them, and the wagon will probably have enough momentum to be a major wagon at eod

    Also Idk about site meta I'm new here too

    Anyway I haven't had anything from vivax ping me but I should probably take a closer look at them tho

    this is for you as well as @Cape90

    do you think that a wagon started on page one off of what even i describe as something not really mafiaish is the basis for a wagon that goes through at the end of the day without critical analysis? it’s early on but you’re both engaging with this now and i’m wondering... do you actually think that, given the posts so far, vivax would have come anywhere close to an actual elimination? (for posterity i’m going to move my vote but i’m unsure where now.)

    it seems... off to me to shade me i guess for pushing vivax as if i wanted to kill him when it’s this early on. maybe it’s culture difference where this sort of thing happens almost every single game but... what do you think i gain from this if i’m mafia?
    If you continue pushing them, then yes I could see that plus a wagon on them to be enough to eliminate them

    Obviously you'd add more points to your case as there are more posts, but at least from my experience it's easier to keep a wagon alive than to start it

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivax (#120)
    #5

    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#110)
    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#108)
    ...do people here not push null reads to help sort? that’s pretty normal from my experiences.
    Pushing them is one thing
    Trying to get a wagon on them seems too much to me tho
    Like, scum!you could just continue pushing them, and the wagon will probably have enough momentum to be a major wagon at eod

    Also Idk about site meta I'm new here too

    Anyway I haven't had anything from vivax ping me but I should probably take a closer look at them tho
    Phoneposting so i‘ll keep it brief.

    I thought you had a plan for everyone to say who the mafia would be based on what a captain would choose.

    Why didn‘t you follow up on your own suggestion?
    One thing I was hoping was for someone to give a very detailed answer, because that's scum indicative as the captain may have detailed reasoning already, whereas town likely need to think about it for the first time. I couldn't really get people to talk about it effectively without mentioning something like this, but of course that would ruin it.

    Also before you say this idea is too correct, I was making this stuff before game started, so I had time to make it good.
    I have good news for you then, my friend. Swedish already gave very detailed reasoning and his top row likely included his teammate already.

    Shall we vote into that and then celebrate?
    Or did I steal your thunder and you were about to call Swedish mafia?

  40. ISO #140
    Soul Reader The Penguin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cape90 (#137)
    Why do you not find this a positive from your POV?
    I dont see it as a negative either, its easy for me to fall into certain habits when just thinking like that, so I put it in writing to remember it for myself

  41. ISO #141
    Wielder of the Triforce Wisdom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwedishSkumbag (#68)

    -----

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisdom (#17)
    Quote Originally Posted by The Penguin (#16)
    Good morning folks,
    I kinda forgot that this was a lightgame when I went to bed yesterday, and was worried that there was gonna be way too much content when I woke up, so this is a happy little accident.

    Anyway, from the content so far, I only got a tiny thing from wisodm and that is who they would choose as mafia captain, or whatever that is called. There would be one mafia in the one the list of people they now, so

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisdom (#13)
    Niphredil, Penguin, Egix and Skumbag. I've played with Cape
    and one outside this small constellation. I am guessing this just based of knowing a bit of their "playstyle" (it isn't a linear and well explained one).

    That's all folks
    Oh POG I forgot about the mafia captain being a thing, even though I was super relieved when no one chose me.

    Maybe hubris but I think that indicates the captain doesn't know me, I tend to be chosen for this kind of thing. At the same time, Skumbag and Penguin probably wouldn't choose me as it would be too obvious.

    And it doesn't really matter if I solve anyone as "not the captain", they can still be wolves. And I don't think people know others meta well enough for someone to be an obvious pick (I thought I was the most likely, so I want to believe the captain is a new one, but yeah that line of thinking is probably a trap)

    Already started to go in circles with my thinking.

    TLDR
    I'm town for some weird reason


    @Wisdom Aren't the like 20 turbos as V in a row making you have the mafia itch? Or are turbos and long games like *completely* different things? Talk to me about why you wanted to rand town this game specifically

    ---------
    ?
    I just finished a two-three week wolf game on FoL. It's the turbo town streak that's weirding me out, I don't pray for a wolf rand outside of that.

    But the reasoning behind the post/feeling/mindset is that I played a similar game on Syndicate recently where the Captain chose me, bussed me, got me killed d1, then d2 threw a tantrum so hard the game had to be canned.

    So yeah, this is the second time I play with a captain and I hope the experience will be better this game. Being town helps.

    ---

    SS could be town, I'm looking for a certain thing but I have him as town for the moment.

    ---

    Someone said I was wolfy because I said I was gonna focus on reading the people I know how to read first and foremost. I think the argument is very flawed + I haven't even focused on them so it's a bit provoking.

    ---

    I might not be able to catch up, but I'm planning to use my posts well and recommend some awareness in post/content ratio.

  42. ISO #142
    Wielder of the Triforce Wisdom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwedishSkumbag (#69)
    Very interesting. There had been exactly 2 people giving townleans on Egix at this point. If it was like 5 I'd more follow your read, but this? HMMM.

    @Wisdom were you aware it was only 2 townreads there at this time when you made the read or did you think it was more?
    Felt like more. Don't care. Egix lock town never rescinding!

    For legal reasons this is a joke.

  43. ISO #143
    Wielder of the Triforce Wisdom's Avatar
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    @SwedishSkumbag did you intentionally derp?

    30 is the post cap. And the cap doesn't life before EoD. Burning all posts now is a terrible idea because everyone hasn't even joined thread yet.

    ---

    Reminder: you can still vote by proxy (at the bottom) after you're capped.

    ---

    I think Niphredil is town. If I'm wrong I'll probably figure it out later on, but posting so far is nice.

    Vivax feels towny as well. I don't
    really
    think they've done anything they can't fake but it feels pro town. A good look for now at least!

  44. ISO #144
    Galaxy Brain SwedishSkumbag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dawoodle (#1)
    Return of the Ultralight


    Posting Requirement: Minimum of 5 posts per day phase, hard maximum of (3 times the number of living players) posts per day phase (so d1 will be 45 ppd, d2 - 39 ppd, d3 - 33, etc down to a minimum of 20 ppd) which will not be lifted at any point in the phase. Hard limit of 2000 characters per post..[/list]
    Quote Originally Posted by Dawoodle (#2)
    Host Notes*
    * shamelessly stolen from bbt
    (you probably want to read these, or at least note the bold)

    • Reminder that you are limited to 3 * # of living players posts per day phase (for D1, this is 45 posts) and this limit will not be removed before EoD. Each post is limited to 2000 characters; you're welcome to break up longer posts into chunks and post them in succession if you wish. I will post the post limit at each SoD as a reminder since I don't typically run games with variable post limits.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dawoodle (#6)
    Day 1 has started!

    You have a hard limit 45 total posts toDay with a limit of 2000 characters per post.



    no u

    @Wisdom

    Also I agree with Niph town (I had the thought b4 u said it!!!!), i'll go into why in a later post

  45. ISO #145
    Thread Analyst Scipio1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#42)
    I know literally no one in this game

    Anyway I think it'd make sense if we all said who we'd choose if we were mafia captain and why

    I'd choose 2 experienced/active players, because honestly I don't think the "experienced players would be picked" is enough to prevent the experienced scum to convince people otherwise, especially since there'd be me, a less experienced player on the team as well
    I really do not like this especially considering this is their first post of the game
    Like it just leads to pointless speculation and wifom

    Quote Originally Posted by Numka (#46)
    Yeah, I was just thinking how it seems like I was wrong 😅 Well, doesn't surprise me lol
    This looks overly self-conscious over something that doesn't really matter
    Also kinda didn't like numka's entrance in the first place but not sure why

    Quote Originally Posted by Valentine (#64)
    hmmm.

    beagle’s entrance was sparser than vivax’s but i actually don’t think it’s as weird.. weirdly enough. they didn’t go out of their way to interact with anyone, which feels a bit more towny? less concerned with making connections with people, etc.

    (yes i am reading that much into it.)
    I like this read and also like valentine's posting in general
    I disagree with egix about beagle's entrance being LAMIST-y

    Quote Originally Posted by SwedishSkumbag (#68)
    @Scipio1 what are you referring to here by overly aggressive?
    I think ichigo was pressing too far into wisdom's entrance post when I didn't see anything wrong with it
    At the same time I don't think he was actually calling them scummy but rather just pushing so it's probably just a playstyle thing

    Quote Originally Posted by SwedishSkumbag (#81)
    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#66)
    I don't like how wisdom chose specific players to focus on like that

    Seems like a good excuse to not read scummates

    Imo it would make more sense to focus on anything that pings you

    Also, I doubt wisdom genuinely forgot about the mafia captain existing

    ##Vote Wisdom
    i missed this post earlier tbh. mmmm.
    i think i lean this part slightly V

    (zug moves up a tier in my list to weak V)
    Can you talk about this? I'm kinda feeling the opposite

  46. ISO #146
    Galaxy Brain SwedishSkumbag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by niphredil (#131)
    Quote Originally Posted by zergon (#121)
    niphredil: Post #102, I agree on Kuro, and Cape. Disagree on Numka towny read (and Wisdom but I see the logic there). Need to see bit more before deciding were to go with this spot.
    (tbh about numka i did have a pre-game thought that "numka probably will be town bc she's been lhf enough in her previous games that she probably isn't getting picked into any wolfteams", and that might affect on why i'm townreading her pretty easily here lmao)

    and tbh i kinda think that a lot of the reasons why people are pushing valentine here are just nitpicking on word choices / playculture differences, rather than anything actually AI
    but also i don't really have a read on valentine so i'm not really opposed to them being pushed atm
    my reason for Niph town is purely this post, and it's mainly the bolded (even if i think the un-bolded is a villagery thought as well).

    I think if wolf!Niph decides to use this reason to townlean numka (which i think is unlikely on its own tbh) they'd just use this straight away in their readslist. But to use another reason, then get called out for it, step back, and then realize "oh i was prolly influenced by X so my initial reason was prolly bull$%#! now that you point it out but i'm right anyway" just seems like a villager.

    Niph's my new top Villager

  47. ISO #147
    Thread Analyst Scipio1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beagle (#123)
    Zergon
    town
    I want to townread this

  48. ISO #148
    Wielder of the Triforce Wisdom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dawoodle (#1)
    About character limits: There will be a hard limit of 30 posts per day, with a character limit of 2000 characters per post,
    This game is dumb and Dawoodle is a dork.

    [Insert how can you be a god and unable to read quote here]

    Yeah you're right, 45 it is. I didn't read too carefully^^

  49. ISO #149
    Galaxy Brain SwedishSkumbag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scipio1 (#145)

    Quote Originally Posted by Numka (#46)
    Yeah, I was just thinking how it seems like I was wrong 😅 Well, doesn't surprise me lol
    This looks overly self-conscious over something that doesn't really matter
    Also kinda didn't like numka's entrance in the first place but not sure why


    Quote Originally Posted by SwedishSkumbag (#81)
    Quote Originally Posted by Zugzwang (#66)
    I don't like how wisdom chose specific players to focus on like that

    Seems like a good excuse to not read scummates

    Imo it would make more sense to focus on anything that pings you

    Also, I doubt wisdom genuinely forgot about the mafia captain existing

    ##Vote Wisdom
    i missed this post earlier tbh. mmmm.
    i think i lean this part slightly V

    (zug moves up a tier in my list to weak V)
    Can you talk about this? I'm kinda feeling the opposite
    -why do you think being overly self-conscious over something that isn't game related would be alignment indicative? And what posts was it in Numka's entrance that you didn't like (even if you don't know why)

    -Tbh i don't really have a very convincing answer to why i found that part towny. I just felt like he probably believed it, maybe from the tone? (but it's not a strong read of mine at all)

  50. ISO #150
    Galaxy Brain SwedishSkumbag's Avatar
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    Oh, I should mention. I believe Wisdom's self-meta about why they wanted to rand V, and even if I told Val not to townread them from selfmeta earlier, I'm still giving them a mini-townpoint for the earlier opening now that I understand their mindset at the time.

    Also kinda like their "waiting for a specific thing" wrt me, but we'll see what happens to that as time goes on

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Role of the Day
Hero

The Hero will passively and reflexively kill any King who attempts to execute the Hero.