fix compulsive "error"

[Twice Shrunk]

so, im running a test and i have the compulsive role oracle set to kill the person who gets nked, then i dayvig them

at sod2, this is what it says in red next to where it says your target above the submission box: (Dead / Please reset)

after i dayvig the oracle the role reveal is still on the dead person

for compulsive roles, after this happens (current target dies), could it automatically randomize between all valid options instead of still targeting the dead player?

test: https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/threads/37001-b

[Twice Shrunk]

idk if this has been seen or not so just gonna bump it

[Jaleb]

I think if they choose to target someone the bot shouldn't choose to change for them. Oracles reveal dead players all the time. Happens

[Ezradekezra]

I think there are situations were people might want it to work either way

Might be worth adding a modifier that allows you to target dead players or something like that

[Apoc]

Oracle is a Night Action

So what modbot says during the day phase shouldn't matter at all. Their target is still the dead player until the next night.

Even if you the role automatically changed to a new target, that target would not be set until night 2.

I'm confused about your test case here...why are you dayvigging them? It makes the whole thing moot

[DkKoba]

the oracle is a role from Epicmafia - so I can explain that this is not how the role is intended to work at all the way you want it to.

The target only updates as part of a night action, not as a passive action. So if you end up on the nightkill, tough luck, you need to survive to next night to update it.

If this role is changed, it makes setups that are designed to use them(such as Jan 3.0) not work properly.

Oracle is primarily designed as a town role and is used that way in most cases so if you want it to work the way you want it to - it is probably better to do it manually.

[DkKoba]

I think there are situations were people might want it to work either way

Might be worth adding a modifier that allows you to target dead players or something like that

Role Oracle cannot choose dead players(it doesn't target btw)

It chooses a player and if that player happens to die overnight oh well, that's how it is, your choice is still that player.


It works with Janitor though - which is a case where that might be actually beneficial.

[Twice Shrunk]

Oracle is a Night Action

So what modbot says during the day phase shouldn't matter at all. Their target is still the dead player until the next night.

Even if you the role automatically changed to a new target, that target would not be set until night 2.

I'm confused about your test case here...why are you dayvigging them? It makes the whole thing moot

The problem here is that your starting assumption - that it is a night action - is incorrect. Or, at least, it's not programmed that way into Modbot.

You can run a test game yourself to test that, I don't have any test games to back this up but I ran a game a few months ago with role oracle and have just double checked the host info thread and the oracle (with zero modifiers) changed their target during the day.

I agree with the logic, but again, you're starting with a flawed assumption so this is moot.

[Twice Shrunk]

I'd also like to clarify that this case is only when the oracle has the compulsive modifier attached to it.

Compulsive means that the player must submit a valid target, and if their target gets nked, well, they're not longer a valid target.

And, as role oracle can submit at anytime, a compulsive role oracle should have to retarget immediately after the player becomes no longer a valid target, or have the result randomized.

I also don't think the argument that dead players are valid targets holds water here either, as if that were the case, then you should be able to select them in the dropdown menu. You can't.

All these arguments are based off how oracle is currently programmed into modbot, so I also don't think arguments about how oracle is supposed to work exactly make sense in this context - those would be better said in another thread suggesting changes to the way it is currently programmed.

[DkKoba]

It was just explained to you that its a night action and cant be updated. The box on the bottom is just a queue to preselect for the next night

[Twice Shrunk]

This is demonstrably false, like I just said, in a game I ran a few months ago, the role oracle actively updated their sub during the day, and I know this because I asked the oracle to test if they could idle and the update showed up immediately in host info thread.

If it was preselect it would only be updated in that thread at the start of night.

[katze]

I asked the oracle to test if they could idle and the update showed up immediately in host info thread.

If it was preselect it would only be updated in that thread at the start of night.

im fairly sure the bolded is false

e: can confirm with 100% certainty that it is, in fact, false, as in a game i've hosted i have a player updating their action during the day phase despite it being very much so a night action

[DkKoba]

Thats not how it should work lol

[Twice Shrunk]

My bad.

[Twice Shrunk]

That being said, it seems very much that oracle works at anytime.

Ran a test, oracle subbed action D1, when they got hanged D1 the action still went through.

If it was a night action and worked as per how Koba said, the result should have been that there was no reveal.

Test: https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/threads/37021-p

[Apoc]

Oracle is a Night Action

So what modbot says during the day phase shouldn't matter at all. Their target is still the dead player until the next night.

Even if you the role automatically changed to a new target, that target would not be set until night 2.

I'm confused about your test case here...why are you dayvigging them? It makes the whole thing moot

The problem here is that your starting assumption - that it is a night action - is incorrect. Or, at least, it's not programmed that way into Modbot.

You can run a test game yourself to test that, I don't have any test games to back this up but I ran a game a few months ago with role oracle and have just double checked the host info thread and the oracle (with zero modifiers) changed their target during the day.

I agree with the logic, but again, you're starting with a flawed assumption so this is moot.

the modbot role thread says its a Night Action

you tests in the OP seem to indicate its a night action

[Apoc]

I'd also like to clarify that this case is only when the oracle has the compulsive modifier attached to it.

Compulsive means that the player must submit a valid target, and if their target gets nked, well, they're not longer a valid target.

And, as role oracle can submit at anytime, a compulsive role oracle should have to retarget immediately after the player becomes no longer a valid target, or have the result randomized.

I also don't think the argument that dead players are valid targets holds water here either, as if that were the case, then you should be able to select them in the dropdown menu. You can't.

All these arguments are based off how oracle is currently programmed into modbot, so I also don't think arguments about how oracle is supposed to work exactly make sense in this context - those would be better said in another thread suggesting changes to the way it is currently programmed.

It's a compulsive night action, the target was valid when it was chosen

[Apoc]

This is demonstrably false, like I just said, in a game I ran a few months ago, the role oracle actively updated their sub during the day, and I know this because I asked the oracle to test if they could idle and the update showed up immediately in host info thread.

If it was preselect it would only be updated in that thread at the start of night.

If the dropdown is used during the day...it is a pre-submission. It is still a night action and will be processed as such.

Caveat: I've never used an Oracle in modbot, but the modbot thread and common sense both say the above assertion is correct

[Apoc]

Town Role Oracle

Town Role Oracle

"As Town Role Oracle, you have access to the Divine Role Night Action."

[Apoc]

That being said, it seems very much that oracle works at anytime.

Ran a test, oracle subbed action D1, when they got hanged D1 the action still went through.

If it was a night action and worked as per how Koba said, the result should have been that there was no reveal.

Test: https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/threads/37021-p

Looks like a bug to me! This whole thread makes way more sense now

I pinged Makaze in your test thread

[Twice Shrunk]

Cool.