What are your thoughts on what it means to be free?
What are your thoughts on what it means to be free?
#MahsaAmini
There's freedom in the sense of political freedom via civil and political rights.
Freedom House is a non-profit, US-based organization that conducts the annual Freedom in the World survey.
You can view the methodology for the survey here.
The survey asks questions such as:
- "Was the current head of government or other chief national authority elected through free and fair elections?"
- "Do various segments of the population (including ethnic, racial, religious, gender, LGBT+, and other relevant groups) have full political rights and electoral opportunities?"
- "Do individuals enjoy equality of opportunity and freedom from economic exploitation?"
- And many more
The answers to these questions are then aggregated to assign a score to each country.
Green countries are free, yellow are partly free, blue-grey are not free.
More information can be found on the wikipedia page. Or in the latest published 2022 report.
Alternatively, the Economist Intelligence Unit compiles the Democracy Index every year.
The index has a related goal as Freedom House's report in answering questions on civil liberties, electoral process, political participation, and freedom of elections.
The latest report can be downloaded here which includes methodology. Alternatively you can read more about it on wikipedia.
Another way to view freedom is through the lens of human development. Is someone who lives in a democracy with all the civil liberties they could want, but isn't able to afford shelter or food really free?
And for that there's the Human Development Index which is compiled by the United Nations Development Programme in it's annual Human Development Report.
The report attempts to compile factors such as life expectancy, education, economic prospects, and standard of living together into its index. You can view a summary of the methodology on Wikipedia.
There's also the lens of financial freedom, this is something that's measured on an individual to individual basis rather than through a geopolitical lens. There's those that lack financial freedom, going into debt, and living paycheck to paycheck all the way up to the ultra-wealthy that are able to afford anything they could ever want without having to work another day in their life.
So what does Freedom mean to me?
Well - I think it means all of these things at the same time.
Ultimately, freedom is a catch all word for an abstract ideal.
the conclusion i'm drawing is that we should all go move to scandanavia or new zealand
You might be on to something here
what is something ur rly passionate about but never had a chance to talk about (talk about it)
whos a bigger nerd, you or arete (and why)
do you believe in magic
do you believe that friendship is magic
⠀i'll $%#!in sit on ur mouth $%#!
Yo katze
I feel like this might have been a joke post
But also i feel like there's some truth behind every joke and I just got pinged by this
So can you tell me the rationale behind this post?Originally Posted by nutella
Am I really random to you
THE SCRUBS LOLCAT COLLECTION
kat talking to Chloe
Tim when the towncore tries to do literally anything
The whole dya/Hally argument
Chloe to nutella
Hally and spf's fake mindmelds
Chloe and kat slowly getting converted to Syndicateers
This thread when spf says a thing
I couldn't find an analogy here, have this fun clip
People were getting drunk at various points so this one has to be relevant somehow
This one wasn't too relevant, generally friendly thread, but I'm running out of ideas
How playing in role madness feelsThis thread when <player who feels excluded> posts
PoV: You're getting FoSed by Venti
How it would've gone if I had cc'ed
Ghana in any of his posts that involve the word "queen"
The consensus PoE this game
This better be an apt description of someone's mentor chat
The average reaction test this game
I don't even know but there can't possibly not be an analogy here right
Twice simping for towncred
Me procrastinating on everything this gameYou are not allowed to own a dog.
Literally stop what you're doing and watch Sangatsu no Lion
It's like The Queen's Gambit but good
Miiight not be for you, it's a lot heavier than the stuff you've named here even though it's generally a wholesome slice-of-life drama, it's got very intimate depictions of depression and abuse, but if you can tolerate that it's pretty much a must-watch weeb or not
Mainly season 1 IMO but season 2 is great too and you'll probably want more time with the characters after seeing season 1
Also you'll probably like Mob if you like these ig
THE SCRUBS LOLCAT COLLECTION
kat talking to Chloe
Tim when the towncore tries to do literally anything
The whole dya/Hally argument
Chloe to nutella
Hally and spf's fake mindmelds
Chloe and kat slowly getting converted to Syndicateers
This thread when spf says a thing
I couldn't find an analogy here, have this fun clip
People were getting drunk at various points so this one has to be relevant somehow
This one wasn't too relevant, generally friendly thread, but I'm running out of ideas
How playing in role madness feelsThis thread when <player who feels excluded> posts
PoV: You're getting FoSed by Venti
How it would've gone if I had cc'ed
Ghana in any of his posts that involve the word "queen"
The consensus PoE this game
This better be an apt description of someone's mentor chat
The average reaction test this game
I don't even know but there can't possibly not be an analogy here right
Twice simping for towncred
Me procrastinating on everything this gameYou are not allowed to own a dog.
Good takes ITTNutella also asked a question on music taste and I still haven't gotten around to answering it yet!
I generally don't listen to music as full albums - but I'll give a more detailed answer to this and nutellas question later!
THE SCRUBS LOLCAT COLLECTION
kat talking to Chloe
Tim when the towncore tries to do literally anything
The whole dya/Hally argument
Chloe to nutella
Hally and spf's fake mindmelds
Chloe and kat slowly getting converted to Syndicateers
This thread when spf says a thing
I couldn't find an analogy here, have this fun clip
People were getting drunk at various points so this one has to be relevant somehow
This one wasn't too relevant, generally friendly thread, but I'm running out of ideas
How playing in role madness feelsThis thread when <player who feels excluded> posts
PoV: You're getting FoSed by Venti
How it would've gone if I had cc'ed
Ghana in any of his posts that involve the word "queen"
The consensus PoE this game
This better be an apt description of someone's mentor chat
The average reaction test this game
I don't even know but there can't possibly not be an analogy here right
Twice simping for towncred
Me procrastinating on everything this gameYou are not allowed to own a dog.
Wisp: how are u a god and unable to read at the same time
PunchyTheCat: WHAT TEH ACTUAL $%#!ING WHAT THE ACTUAL WHAT WHO LET THIS HAPPEN WHY WISDOM WAS SOOOO TOWNY WTF
Chloe: I'm never trusting you again Wisdom
What do you want more questions about??
Wisp: how are u a god and unable to read at the same time
PunchyTheCat: WHAT TEH ACTUAL $%#!ING WHAT THE ACTUAL WHAT WHO LET THIS HAPPEN WHY WISDOM WAS SOOOO TOWNY WTF
Chloe: I'm never trusting you again Wisdom
Which games gives you nostalgia?
Which games are you looking forward to getting released?
Which games should get a remake?
Which games are too good to get a remake?
Which games should get a sequel?
Which games do you think about when you think about love/joy with other people?
Videogames.
Wisp: how are u a god and unable to read at the same time
PunchyTheCat: WHAT TEH ACTUAL $%#!ING WHAT THE ACTUAL WHAT WHO LET THIS HAPPEN WHY WISDOM WAS SOOOO TOWNY WTF
Chloe: I'm never trusting you again Wisdom
You're stuck on a deserted island but you're allowed 1 food which you will always produce infinitely somehow. What food will it be.
What would you tell Lumi 10 years ago
You're stuck on a deserted island but you're allowed 1 human companion which will always regenerate itself somehow
who will you cannibalize
⠀i'll $%#!in sit on ur mouth $%#!
Yo katze
I feel like this might have been a joke post
But also i feel like there's some truth behind every joke and I just got pinged by this
So can you tell me the rationale behind this post?
You're stuck on a deserted island, but a magical portal opens that will give you a one way trip to live in a fictional universe of your choice, at the cost of giving up all hope of rescue or return to this world. What will you do?
Do you believe in spirits?
Wisp: how are u a god and unable to read at the same time
PunchyTheCat: WHAT TEH ACTUAL $%#!ING WHAT THE ACTUAL WHAT WHO LET THIS HAPPEN WHY WISDOM WAS SOOOO TOWNY WTF
Chloe: I'm never trusting you again Wisdom
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
avatar art credit to chardonnay/bland
I have a lot of mediocre answers to this question
I chronically find something interesting, binge on it for a short period of time, then lose interest in it and move on to something else.
I'll come back to this one after I think about it more!
Definitely Arete, being a nerd is a complement and Arete is great
LOL
I actually did quite like that show for a while when it first came out. I was at a very dark time in my life and it's cute, saccharine sweetness and positive outlook helped a lot.
Added it to our watch list!
Literally stop what you're doing and watch Sangatsu no Lion
It's like The Queen's Gambit but good
Miiight not be for you, it's a lot heavier than the stuff you've named here even though it's generally a wholesome slice-of-life drama, it's got very intimate depictions of depression and abuse, but if you can tolerate that it's pretty much a must-watch weeb or not
Mainly season 1 IMO but season 2 is great too and you'll probably want more time with the characters after seeing season 1
Also you'll probably like Mob if you like these ig
Might be the next thing we watch after we catch up on TDP Season 3!
Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Day 4 Event
The window closes at 1:00 PM EDT on Thursday, July 14th, 2022. There are 1657818060000 remaining.Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM
Hello MarkoRaj, you are roro__b.
Better known as Dobby, you are a part of the lifeblood of this site. You have been involved in the site as a player, moderator, host and walri enthusiast for years. You are perhaps best known for your amazing flavor (who could forget the Congress of Vienna) and childlike sense of humor (peepeepoopoo anyone?). Your dedication to MU and desire to make the site (and every game you are involved with) welcoming to everyone is an inspiration for us all.
You are a Villager, and you have the following abilities:
- Mod aboos: Every Day, you may PM the hosts a link to the post of another player who wished for something in bold purple font and grant their wish. That player will have their wish granted and receive a 1-shot ability to use that night.
The following wish restrictions apply:
- They must only wish for items with a 1-shot ability.
- They must only wish for 1 item at a time.
- They must not wish for a day action.
The following role restrictions apply:
- You may only grant ONE cop check of any type during the game.
- You may not grant any Watcher abilities.
- You may not grant any Vigilante or Killing abilities.
- The game hosts reserve the right to refuse any wish they deem to be overpowered.
- peepee poopoo: You may not hint in ANY way or claim your role, or you will lose your abilities. However, you may still post wishes in the game thread.
MU Anniversary 2022 Game ThreadWhat's the point of them outing like this as a wolf, though?
It feels like that ideally for W!Arete that they should be playing the long game with their positioning in the thread.
Event Result: Arete has died
Arete has died. They were a Wolf:
Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM
Hello Arete, you are illario.
Honestly, what is your name!? illario? Happy? We get that everyone can be happy though, it's a good name tbh. You're part of the group of EMers that have recently (or, not that recently anymore) been showing up in most games on the site. A very welcome addition. Your improvement in skill level is by far one of the most significant ones on the site, and you've definitely become a force to be reckoned with... Which maybe isn't that weird since you've played about five hundred mashes, five thousand normal games, and fifty thousand turbos this past year. Your performance in this year's Champs game 7 when you brought your team to a clear win, landing you a first place in the player votes, is a clear an indication of that as any.
You are a Wolf, and you have the following abilities:
- Sacrifices need to be made: Every night, starting n1, you may target another player and submit a list of 5 names, at least one of which must be a wolf. The target will be given this list of 5 names and told that there is at least one wolf in the names. You cannot target the same player on consecutive nights.
- As long as the wolves end up winning: If the above ability targets a non-wolf, they will be roleblocked on that night and the following day. Their ITA hit chance will be reduced to 0 on the following day.
You may now discuss the event and subsequent voting if you wish.
I like questions about pretty much anything!
Me, my past, hypotheticals, preferences, random trivia, tier lists, and any questions I didn't anticipate with these categories already
Video games is a good category!
Maybe some weird picks in here,
Super Mario Galaxy - loved this game a bunch, was the first Nintendo game I played too, it brings back memories of playing Super Mario Galaxy in the living room as Grandma comes home with a pizza to eat with me, my siblings, and Grandpa.
SimCity 4 - played this game a bunch in like 2005/2006, brings back memories of just having no cares in the world other than city I was building
Undertale - it's 7 years old now, I think that's old enough to qualify for nostalgia - brings back memories of my first couple of years at university and hanging out with my friend who recommended the game to me. He was also the one who recommended Steven Universe to me which was began my journey into the world of "Kids shows that are actually really good and fun to watch as an adult too" - Undertale and Steven Universe, both things I know you also really enjoyed, @Wisdom !
Dota 2 - reminds me of countless hours spent on VC with friends in highschool just having fun and then going to The International 5 together to see the North American team, EG, win it all. (That was my one aforementioned visit to Seattle)
Minecraft - ultimate nostalgia game, played with my younger brother, played with friends in high school, played with friends at university, played with my spouse. Brings back all those happy memories
I generally am more reactive when it comes to game selection. Have gotten burned once by pre-ordering a game, I now almost always just wait for games to release, get reviews, patches, etc. and then decide if it's worth buying it!
Super niche pick - Caravaneer 2.
It's "a post-apocalyptic trade simulation game that features detailed economics simulation"
It was a small indie project originally made in flash and released in 2014. It aims for more of a gritty realism feel where you have to plan trade routes while accounting for how much food and water you'll need, people and weapons to protect your caravan, all while leaving enough weight for tradeable goods to be bought in one post-apocalyptic desert town and sold in another.
There's also a branching story which I think is quite neat.
Understandably though, this game is pretty much never getting a remake - it's old, it's indie, it's way too niche for that kind of thing, and almost no one has even heard of it.
I think it really depends on what the remake is - if it's just porting the game to run better on modern machines in a more accessible format, then pretty much any game can be remade.
If it's a graphics overhaul, then it has less to do with how good they are, and more to do with whether or not the graphics are intentionally stylized or not. Like it wouldn't make any sense to do a graphics update on games like VVVVVV, Undertale, FTL, or Baba is You
I would love to see a Crypt of the Necrodancer sequel, they already sort of do that via DLC - but a full sequel to the game with a new storyline, all new soundtracks, new characters, challenges, etc would be super hype!
(Also Caravaneer 2, my super niche pick again lol)
A lot of answers to this already in the notalgia section - but some more examples! Divinity Original Sin 2 and Valheim bring back very fond memories of playing through the games with my love
And playing games with friends brings me joy
I recently played through Terraria again with Wiml just a few months ago! We had a ton of fun playing through the game together (and got absolutely awful RNG on one of the boss fights having to do it like 20 times)
Arete and I play Twilight Struggle and Dominion together semi-regularly, Arete's amazing and gets good at games shockingly fast!
And I have a so much fun playing playing Tetris with Illwei, even though our schedules have barely overlapped lately due to working at opposite times of the day.
Really the thing I love most about games is sharing them and playing them with other people! It's why so many of my favorite games are multiplayer! And I'm always happy to try new games and play with new people, anyone is welcome to message me on Discord if they want to play something!
Last edited by Lumi; November 17th, 2022 at 03:57 PM.
My favorite food, the satellite cellphone with a side of fully charged batteries!
I'd go for maybe... Chicken Noodle Soup?
On a deserted island, I have to be smart about what I pick because it's presumably going to be my only source of food. A soup is a good choice because it will have lots of broth to drink to stay hydrated. The chicken will provide protein, the noodles will provide carbs, and the assorted vegetables will provide the vitamins and minerals I need.
An important thing to consider is the butterfly effect. If I tell past me the winning power ball numbers for a date years, months, or even weeks into the future, who knows how that knowledge will change how I act - a butterfly flapping its wings and all that - and then the existence of that knowledge itself might cause those numbers to not actually be winning anymore.
So I'd include a wide range of financial advice, ranging from things like winning powerball numbers, to sports outcomes for sports betting, to stocks that are going to spike, to the generic "invest in bitcoin" - at least one of those should hit.
There's also the concern with the butterfly effect making it so that I never meet the people that are important to me, so I'd make sure to include a list of the contact information of everyone who I want to make sure I make contact with in one way or another.
I'd also tell young me that, unfortunately, you were raised with super $%#! political views and you need to start thinking for yourself ASAP rather than listening to the bull$%#! you were raised with. Explore your identity more, don't be afraid. (Except the actual message would be less cryptic)
I'm probably forgetting something important and clever that I'll later regret not sending, but oh well!
I don't think I could bring myself to cannibalism even in this scenario
Ideally I wouldn't have to go through the portal and could get rescued to see the people I love again.
But the probability of being rescued from a deserted island is pretty slim.
As for choice of universe, hmmm
By far the most important thing isn't how interesting the world is - it's how high the quality of life just living there as a mundane person would be. So going to any sort of fantasy setting with magic or the like would probably be ill-advised just because there's no guarantee that I'd even have access to magic. I think the Star Trek universe would probably be a good choice! I've hardly watched any Star Trek, but I know that it's a post-scarcity economy with super advanced tech - which makes it a prime candidate for fictional universes to just live in!
I do not!
⠀i'll $%#!in sit on ur mouth $%#!
Yo katze
I feel like this might have been a joke post
But also i feel like there's some truth behind every joke and I just got pinged by this
So can you tell me the rationale behind this post?
Should education be digital/automated?
Should guns exist?
Should people pray?
Should we do space science?
Should there be a Super Mario Galaxy 3?
Wisp: how are u a god and unable to read at the same time
PunchyTheCat: WHAT TEH ACTUAL $%#!ING WHAT THE ACTUAL WHAT WHO LET THIS HAPPEN WHY WISDOM WAS SOOOO TOWNY WTF
Chloe: I'm never trusting you again Wisdom
WISDOM HAS JUST INFORMED ME THAT THERE ACTUALLY IS A NECRODANCER SEQUEL
HOW DID I NOT KNOW ABOUT THIS????
Okay what sequel that doesn't exist would you like?
Wisp: how are u a god and unable to read at the same time
PunchyTheCat: WHAT TEH ACTUAL $%#!ING WHAT THE ACTUAL WHAT WHO LET THIS HAPPEN WHY WISDOM WAS SOOOO TOWNY WTF
Chloe: I'm never trusting you again Wisdom
Ok, I have to think long and hard about what sequel I want to retcon into existence nextOkay what sequel that doesn't exist would you like?
I think education can be automated and digital in some ways - but off the top of my head there are two major issues with it:
1) As soon as a student doesn't understand a concept, if it's all digital and automated then there's no one there to help troubleshoot their misunderstanding.
2) The pragmatic fact that kids are less likely to pay attention with all the distractions of a digital device in the comfort of their home compared to in a classroom. It was a pretty common anecdote to hear that kids learned basically nothing during the all-online covid era.
That said, there are brilliant educational YouTube channels out there, Veritasium is one of my favorites
3Blue1Brown is great, ExtraCredits - History is great, History Matters is great, Numberphile is great, Kurzgesagt is great, MinutePhysics is great, SciShow is great - and sites like Brilliant and Khan Academy are all great tools for learning in a digital age. And it works great for some people - I love them all.
Buuut it's really not for everyone. And I'd be wary about attempts to replace in-person learning entirely.
Especially since the social aspect of education can be just as important as the actual content - the world is social, many career opportunities come about as a result of networking and social connections, and so the social skills learned at school and the social side of universities can be just as important and isn't so easily transferred to the digital space!
Should guns exist at all?
Guns are necessary for people living in arctic regions for protection against polar bears. So that alone is justification for them existing
I also think there are necessary military applications for them.
And hunting to control wildlife populations for the preservation of ecosystems can be important too.
That said - I generally dislike guns and think that the issues with gun violence in the US is extremely obviously because of the prevalence of guns here, and the mental gymnastics that people do to try to say otherwise is farcical
I don't, I'm not religious, but if it makes them happy/gives them a sense of purpose/whatever then there are no issues with it.
Religion is fine, I draw the line though when people attempt to apply their religious beliefs on other people.
Which is also unfortunately far too frequent with cancers like Christian Nationalism and Evangelicals
Yes.
Are there areas that are more important than space science? Yes, quite a few.
But science is interconnected, research in one area can often have positive impacts on other fields. And so choosing to cease all space science would be foolish.
I'd love it!
I think Super Mario Odyssey was the spiritual successor to Galaxy in a lot of ways. But at least for me, there's something so charming about the space theme that I'd like to see brought back!
Divinity: Original Sin 2Okay what sequel that doesn't exist would you like?
I know Baldur's Gate 3 is advertised as a sort of sequel gameplay wise (not story wise, but that's fine, the story of Divinity: Original Sin 2 is secondary in a lot of ways to just it's sense of grand adventure)
But it's still in early access and has 25% negative reviews, which is five times more than Divinity's 5%
Starcraft 3 would also be neat, would be sad to see the Starcraft IP die
mostly-stupid thought experiment time
one box or two
Several people are playing a forum mafia game, including three people: Alice (a villager), Bob (a wolf), and B0b (a villager). Alice mistakenly thinks Bob and B0b are the same person. She only reads half the game thread (it is a mash, so this is socially acceptable), and does not see any of Bob's posts, but does see all of B0b's posts. Alice thinks that B0b's posts are extremely wolfy, and decides to case Bob, successfully pushing his elimination. She is then nightkilled. Did Alice play well? Did she have good reads?
A supervillain ties a tiny Thought Experiment Homing Missile to a trolley track. The missile is small and resilient, so it will predictably go undetected for 150 years. In 150 years, it will kill the living human nearest to it. Is this ethically equivalent to the supervillain just killing someone today?
You are playing an Ultimatum Game involving splitting up $10. You are the person who is supposed to accept or reject the money. What is the smallest amount of money you accept?
as above, but instead, $10 million is being divided up. The person splitting the money offers you $1 million, keeping $9 million for themself. Do you accept the split?
as in the first ultimatum game, but instead you are the one proposing the split. What split do you offer?
You are walking by a shallow pond, less than a foot deep, when you see a small child drowning in it (they are a child which is why they are drowning even though it isn't very deep). unfortunately, you are wearing a $5000 suit. you don't have time to take off your suit before jumping in. are you ethically obligated to save the child's life, even if it ruins your suit?
You are playing a standard prisoner's dilemma (the kind with money not the kind with literal prison time). You have been assigned to play against a random stranger. Do you cooperate or defect?
As above, but you're playing against a copy of yourself
As above, but you're playing against a person who has sworn a magically binding oath to only ever Cooperate, which you know about
As above, but you're playing against a person who has sworn a magically binding oath to only ever Defect, which you know about
As above, but you're playing against a person who has sworn a magically binding oath to Cooperate if and only if they expect you to Cooperate, which you know about
As above, but you're playing against katze
As above, but you're playing against me
As above, but you're playing against a copy of me from before we ever met
You are in charge of magically creating a new universe. You can choose between two options, both of which are generally stable (e.g. not going to have a massive change in either total population or average wellbeing). You can choose between a world with 10 billion people, all of whom have lives that are only slightly good, or 1 billion people, all of whom have fantastic lives (more than 10x as happy as the 10 billion people world). Which do you pick?
Someone starts a "business." They inform all their customers, "the way this works is, you give me $10,000, and I steal it and do nothing to benefit you." A customer gives them $10,000. Is it unethical to then steal it and do nothing to benefit the customer?
you are looking at the signups for a forum mafia game. You realize while looking at the setup that it's possible to mechanically lock it for town from the start of the game. However, doing this is really complicated, and you don't think anyone else in the game will be able to figure it out. Are you obligated to inform the host pre-rand that this is possible? If you don't, is it acceptable for you to then use the weird loophole strategy that you figured out?
A runaway trolley is running down a train track. You can choose to send it onto one of two train tracks. (if you choose neither it will run over everyone). On one train track is a person who was kidnapped by a supervillain and tied down there by force. On the other train track are five people who thought it would be really funny to take a nap on a train track. Who do you kill?
Last edited by Arete; November 18th, 2022 at 01:37 AM.
Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Day 4 Event
The window closes at 1:00 PM EDT on Thursday, July 14th, 2022. There are 1657818060000 remaining.Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM
Hello MarkoRaj, you are roro__b.
Better known as Dobby, you are a part of the lifeblood of this site. You have been involved in the site as a player, moderator, host and walri enthusiast for years. You are perhaps best known for your amazing flavor (who could forget the Congress of Vienna) and childlike sense of humor (peepeepoopoo anyone?). Your dedication to MU and desire to make the site (and every game you are involved with) welcoming to everyone is an inspiration for us all.
You are a Villager, and you have the following abilities:
- Mod aboos: Every Day, you may PM the hosts a link to the post of another player who wished for something in bold purple font and grant their wish. That player will have their wish granted and receive a 1-shot ability to use that night.
The following wish restrictions apply:
- They must only wish for items with a 1-shot ability.
- They must only wish for 1 item at a time.
- They must not wish for a day action.
The following role restrictions apply:
- You may only grant ONE cop check of any type during the game.
- You may not grant any Watcher abilities.
- You may not grant any Vigilante or Killing abilities.
- The game hosts reserve the right to refuse any wish they deem to be overpowered.
- peepee poopoo: You may not hint in ANY way or claim your role, or you will lose your abilities. However, you may still post wishes in the game thread.
MU Anniversary 2022 Game ThreadWhat's the point of them outing like this as a wolf, though?
It feels like that ideally for W!Arete that they should be playing the long game with their positioning in the thread.
Event Result: Arete has died
Arete has died. They were a Wolf:
Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM
Hello Arete, you are illario.
Honestly, what is your name!? illario? Happy? We get that everyone can be happy though, it's a good name tbh. You're part of the group of EMers that have recently (or, not that recently anymore) been showing up in most games on the site. A very welcome addition. Your improvement in skill level is by far one of the most significant ones on the site, and you've definitely become a force to be reckoned with... Which maybe isn't that weird since you've played about five hundred mashes, five thousand normal games, and fifty thousand turbos this past year. Your performance in this year's Champs game 7 when you brought your team to a clear win, landing you a first place in the player votes, is a clear an indication of that as any.
You are a Wolf, and you have the following abilities:
- Sacrifices need to be made: Every night, starting n1, you may target another player and submit a list of 5 names, at least one of which must be a wolf. The target will be given this list of 5 names and told that there is at least one wolf in the names. You cannot target the same player on consecutive nights.
- As long as the wolves end up winning: If the above ability targets a non-wolf, they will be roleblocked on that night and the following day. Their ITA hit chance will be reduced to 0 on the following day.
You may now discuss the event and subsequent voting if you wish.
:V
I love thought experiments!
You walk into a bar and see 2 Aretes casually talking to each other. One has a Sex on the Beach and one has a simple gin.
Why is Arete in a bar?
Why are there 2 Aretes?
Why are they being friendly?
What do the drinks reveal?
What are they talking about?
Last edited by Twice Shrunk; November 18th, 2022 at 11:23 AM.
I think the kind of perfect predictor described in the problem is likely impossible. And when you start from impossible assumptions, you get non-sensical conclusions.
That said, if I were to code and implement this in a game, it would be trivially easy - just modify how much money is in the second box after they make their choice, which does kind of break the premise - but I think the premise is kind of impossible in the first place! I don't believe in determinism! And under those conditions where the "predictor" is actually just somehow modifying the second box after your prediction, it's better to just take the second box.
No, Alice did not have good reads. This seems like a process vs results question meant to challenge people who exclusively value results or place much more value on results than process.
But I personally value process over results, and results are only valuable insofar as empirically assessing if a process is good or not. But when you know a priori that the process is bad, then the results don't actually matter!
Did Alice play well? Not in the reads department - but given that she cased someone using information that was about an entirely different slot and no one even challenged her on it! Or the people that did challenge her on it she refuted! And it led to the elimination of a wolf who had an entire wolf team to back them up and dispute the case! She probably was particularly persuasive and played well in convincing other players to follow her. Getting people to listen to you and follow you is a valuable skill in FM and is a part of playing well, and in that regard Alice played very well despite having bad process for her reads.
(Although to be clear, it is still possible that she didn't play well. Maybe people followed her because they're friends with her. That's not an example of being persuasive and playing well.
Likewise someone who wasn't listened to didn't necessarily play poorly for not being listened to. Sometimes the blame is more on the people who refused to listen because their reasons for not listening were bad.)
Last edited by Lumi; November 18th, 2022 at 12:17 PM.
No, this is a question about long-termism. The assumption of long termism is that there is a small social discount rate when considering the moral value of the distant future.
This question in particular assumes a discount rate of zero. I definitely do not believe in a discount rate of zero.
This question also assumes a catastrophe rate of zero. I also definitely do not believe in a catastrophe rate of zero.
Last edited by Lumi; November 18th, 2022 at 12:17 PM.
I wouldn't accept anything less than $5
For me at least there is a tangible value to "fairness" I'd easily pay $5 to stick it to whomever was trying to take more than their fair share of ten dollars - like come on.
I value that fairness more than $5
(Note: this is also assuming that the other person is roughly equally well off as me and I'm not depriving someone living in poverty in a developing country of non-trivial amount of money to them. Also going to operate on this assumption for all future thought experiments of this type.)
I easily accept the split here. I value fairness and I value sticking it to an unfair splitter out of principle. But I don't value it even close to $1 million.
In all versions of the game I do even splits.
For small values of money my value of fairness exceeds whatever possible monetary gain I could have made from an unfair split
For large values of money the non-linearity of money makes it not worth the risk of having my gains spited by someone who views the split as unfair.
The problem with this scenario is that I think it frames itself as a question of "are you obligated to spend $5000 to save someone's life?"
But the reality is that this question is pitting a whole host of social norms and reasonable expectations against that $5000.
Like if someone were to wade into water to save a child, the parent of the child would be incredibly thankful.
You would be viewed as a hero, rescuing a child from a shallow pond.
You avoid all sorts of negative scorn had you chosen to just ignore the child.
Why are you wearing a $5000 suit in the first place? I think the vast majority of people that wear suits that expensive can afford to lose $5000.
And then there's just the social expectation of helping people close to you, either in physical proximity or close via relationships.
There's also the implication that only you can save this child, whereas the later scenarios this thought experiment gets applied to are scenarios where really anyone could spend that money to save someone. And people's answers for what is ethical in those two scenarios tends to differ. Is that logical? Maybe? Maybe not? But what doesn't matter is that because it's a consensus, it's also a social norm - and so this hypothetical is pitting itself against that social norm too.
So to answer the original hypothetical - I don't think you're necessarily obligated - but you really should, and I'd probably think poorly of someone who didn't.
It depends on the amount of money at stake.
If it's a small amount of money I cooperate, because of my aforementioned tangible value of fairness.
(In fact - @Object ran a fun little forum game, Liar Game, and in the final round there were all sorts of prisoners' dilemma dynamics! And I attempted to cooperate in all of those dynamics, despite it being perhaps irrational in the context of the game!)
If it's a large amount of money, then the choice gets more difficult and I probably defect?
I think the switching point is somewhere in the 5-digit sums of money range.
My first thought when reading this was "of course I cooperate"
Which means my copy would also have that thought. And so we both cooperate.
In this case I don't think it matters how much money is at stake, I feel a sense of good will towards identical copies of myself, lol
Also depends on amount of money at stake.
For small amounts of money I cooperate.
The switch point here is going to be higher than the first scenario because I know the other person will always cooperate and so there's lower risk - but the switching point is probably not that much higher logarithmically speaking. Maybe a higher 5-digit value or a low 6-digit value.
I guess it also depends on the potential gains from switching. But I think my answers give you a general idea of how I'd answer different hypotheticals in that regard.
Then I always defect. No reason to pursue fairness when I know it won't exist.
It would depend on the nature of their beliefs about me - I think in this scenario my threshold for cooperation goes up a fair amount compared to the first scenario. Since in the first scenario there's the risk of the other person getting greedy, whereas here there's no risk of the other person getting greedy so the risk of cooperation is lower, therefore the threshold for which I'd cooperate is higher.
Always defect.
I'm pretty sure katze is close to the magically bound oath to always defect, so
For small amounts of money I think I would cooperate because it would be amusing to joke about that time you defected when I tried to cooperate with you in a prisoners' dilemma.
For large amounts of money - hmmm. Arete getting money is a positive outcome, I might also just always cooperate because then you would know that I'd always cooperate, and you also (I hope at least lol) have a positive value assigned to Lumi gaining money, and so for you the rational choice would be to maximize the total money gained, and therefore you would cooperate as well.
This is a weird hypothetical because I still feel like that copy of you gaining money is a positive outcome. Even though in this case I think I could reasonable assume you would defect?
For small amounts of money I'd cooperate because it would be amusing to joke, etc etc.
For large amounts of money I think it depends on weird things like "Does this mean there are now two copies of Arete running around in the world?" or "Does that money retroactively get sent to past Arete who now has met me and become friends with me?"
Last edited by Lumi; November 18th, 2022 at 12:16 PM.
Easily 1 billion people with fantastic lives.
I don't place any moral value in creating life. I don't think having kids is some moral good so the worlds in question are basically "a world where everyone is fine, whatever" vs "a world where everyone has fantastic lives" and the fantastic lives world just is the obvious choice.
I feel so strongly about this that I'd even be incredulous of the moral systems of people that would choose the 10 billion world
No, it's not unethical - the customer knew what they were getting
There wasn't any dishonesty at play! The customer was explicitly told - "hey, if you give me money, I'm just going to pocket it and give you nothing in return."
And the customer gave the money anyway!
I don't think you're obligated to inform the host.
I personally would inform the host, but also in my experience hosts can get very defensive about the balance of their game, so I wouldn't push it very hard at all - it's just not worth it. I wouldn't sign for the game though if there were a game-breaking loophole that the host knew about but then refused to fix.
Is it acceptable to use the loophole? I wouldn't do it, I'd just not sign, but if someone did I wouldn't really fault them for it.
Send it on the track with the five people.
Those five people are culpable for being in that scenario in the first place. The one person is not culpable at all.
A sort of analogous scenario would be that an evil wizard is forcing you to choose between giving lung cancer to one random young healthy person who has done nothing to increase their risk of lung cancer. Or to give lung cancer to five chain smokers.
They are enjoying their windfall of large sum's of money from playing the monetary prisoners' dilemma with me.
Because one of the Arete's is a copy of Arete from before Arete ever met me.
They are both in high spirits from their recent monetary gains and also Arete is having fun talking to a past version of themselves
idk if Arete drinks, maybe the drinks are there because Arete knows as little about alcohol as I do and just ordered random things.
The implications of their different choices in the prisoners' dilemmas they conducted against me.
okay so, Cleopatra is deciding whether to eat Thought Experiment Dessert,
What number of Thought Experiment Homing Missiles do you think are equivalent to murdering ten people todayNo, this is a question about long-termism. The assumption of long termism is that there is a small social discount rate when considering the moral value of the distant future.
This question in particular assumes a discount rate of zero. I definitely do not believe in a discount rate of zero.
This question also assumes a catastrophe rate of zero. I also definitely do not believe in a catastrophe rate of zero.
(I'm choosing ten because it plays a little nicer with fractions)
wait why do you think pastrete would defect
Last edited by Arete; November 18th, 2022 at 01:07 PM.
Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Day 4 Event
The window closes at 1:00 PM EDT on Thursday, July 14th, 2022. There are 1657818060000 remaining.Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM
Hello MarkoRaj, you are roro__b.
Better known as Dobby, you are a part of the lifeblood of this site. You have been involved in the site as a player, moderator, host and walri enthusiast for years. You are perhaps best known for your amazing flavor (who could forget the Congress of Vienna) and childlike sense of humor (peepeepoopoo anyone?). Your dedication to MU and desire to make the site (and every game you are involved with) welcoming to everyone is an inspiration for us all.
You are a Villager, and you have the following abilities:
- Mod aboos: Every Day, you may PM the hosts a link to the post of another player who wished for something in bold purple font and grant their wish. That player will have their wish granted and receive a 1-shot ability to use that night.
The following wish restrictions apply:
- They must only wish for items with a 1-shot ability.
- They must only wish for 1 item at a time.
- They must not wish for a day action.
The following role restrictions apply:
- You may only grant ONE cop check of any type during the game.
- You may not grant any Watcher abilities.
- You may not grant any Vigilante or Killing abilities.
- The game hosts reserve the right to refuse any wish they deem to be overpowered.
- peepee poopoo: You may not hint in ANY way or claim your role, or you will lose your abilities. However, you may still post wishes in the game thread.
MU Anniversary 2022 Game ThreadWhat's the point of them outing like this as a wolf, though?
It feels like that ideally for W!Arete that they should be playing the long game with their positioning in the thread.
Event Result: Arete has died
Arete has died. They were a Wolf:
Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM
Hello Arete, you are illario.
Honestly, what is your name!? illario? Happy? We get that everyone can be happy though, it's a good name tbh. You're part of the group of EMers that have recently (or, not that recently anymore) been showing up in most games on the site. A very welcome addition. Your improvement in skill level is by far one of the most significant ones on the site, and you've definitely become a force to be reckoned with... Which maybe isn't that weird since you've played about five hundred mashes, five thousand normal games, and fifty thousand turbos this past year. Your performance in this year's Champs game 7 when you brought your team to a clear win, landing you a first place in the player votes, is a clear an indication of that as any.
You are a Wolf, and you have the following abilities:
- Sacrifices need to be made: Every night, starting n1, you may target another player and submit a list of 5 names, at least one of which must be a wolf. The target will be given this list of 5 names and told that there is at least one wolf in the names. You cannot target the same player on consecutive nights.
- As long as the wolves end up winning: If the above ability targets a non-wolf, they will be roleblocked on that night and the following day. Their ITA hit chance will be reduced to 0 on the following day.
You may now discuss the event and subsequent voting if you wish.
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