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Thread: Should posting other players' winrates in game be allowed: an unbiased bot opinion

  1. ISO #1
    Wants It More Abraxas's Avatar
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    Should posting other players' winrates in game be allowed: an unbiased bot opinion

    Here are chatGPT's thoughts on the matter:
    There was within me an invincible summer

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    Soul Reader Art3mis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxas (#1)
    Here are chatGPT's thoughts on the matter:
    until this moment I had never thought of using someones win/loss ratio to discredit them. I know what I'm doing the next time I play.

    #StayToxic



    for legal purposes this is a joke
    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Fingerhands (#11258)
    btw manti subbing into his own game and vengefully shooting a player called OwO What's This in revenge for shooting my chatbot is
    amazing

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    GOAT Tier Sett's Avatar
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    skill issue tbh

    (joking of course)
    Do not open:


    True story:
    Quote Originally Posted by Sett (#15734)
    Quote Originally Posted by theknightsofneeee (#15677)
    Quote Originally Posted by Phighter (#15664)
    Quote Originally Posted by theknightsofneeee (#15649)
    phighter make a case for me being a wolf other than I think you're a wolf

    GO
    I don't need to, you shooting me after everything I've claimed is more than enough. I have a feeling Sheep may be an important mafia PR, because there is no reason a player with your reputation and skill level rushes something self-resolving without ulterior motives.
    yeah guys

    this is a villager right here /s

    he's called me a villager all game and he's only OMGUS'ing me after i've committed to pushing him for doing obviously wolfy things

    can't even fake a case as to why i'm a wolf cause there literally isn't one lmao
    Can you stop measuring your $%#!ing $%#!s for 2 minutes and realize you're probably both town?


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    Galaxy Brain Twice Shrunk's Avatar
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    chatgtp is just insecure about its own winrate
    Quote Originally Posted by Twice Shrunk (#2684)
    as noted by dvc getting modkilled was optimal play at some point and I am just ahead of my times

  5. ISO #5
    Wants It More Arete's Avatar
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    imo this should clearly be handled on a case-by-case basis -- I do think that many instances of people bringing up other players' winrates are toxic, but I don't necessarily think it's inherently toxic?


    Marl: I am the greatest mafia player ever. Everyone should sheep all of my reads, because I am the best villager on the site. Anyone who doesn't sheep me is bad or a wolf.

    Chloe: your town winrate is literally 25%, dude. I think I'll take my chances.



    Windward: I think katze is a wolf

    katze: wtf, no one with a 35% winrate has any right to say something like that about me. why don't you go back to ToS where you belong, because you definitely don't belong here.


    Given that toxicity is already punishable, I'm not convinced that additional rules changes are necessary

    Also, this is extremely not the main point, but a couple thoughts on ChatGPT's arguments:

    1. You didn't include what prompt you used, only the response. It is pretty easy to manipulate it into giving it a one-sided response by telling it what side to take.
    2. Many of its arguments ... are bad. "It is important to focus on the current games and not bring in past games" -- this is a fully general argument against meta, which is legal.
    3. it's literally a chatbot, I'm not going to pretend it's not a fun toy but it's also not a magic truth oracle
    Quote Originally Posted by MarkoRaj (#36132)
    Grant is a villager @Celever

    Hardclaim
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafia Host (#36240)
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    The contents of the rest of the post are irrelevant, so feel free to flavor it up. Make sure that only the name of the player that you wish to target is inside the BBCode itself.

    After posting, I will quote your post and let you know if your attack succeeded. Good luck!
    The window closes at 1:00 PM EDT on Thursday, July 14th, 2022. There are 1657818060000 remaining.
    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#36251)
    MarkoRaj

    glgl
    Quote Originally Posted by MU Anniversary 2022 (#36346)
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafia Host (#36251)
    Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Day 4 Event

    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#36251)
    MarkoRaj

    glgl
    Hit! MarkoRaj was killed. Stand by for the host to reveal.

    View ITA History

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    Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM

    Hello MarkoRaj, you are roro__b.



    Better known as Dobby, you are a part of the lifeblood of this site. You have been involved in the site as a player, moderator, host and walri enthusiast for years. You are perhaps best known for your amazing flavor (who could forget the Congress of Vienna) and childlike sense of humor (peepeepoopoo anyone?). Your dedication to MU and desire to make the site (and every game you are involved with) welcoming to everyone is an inspiration for us all.


    You are a Villager, and you have the following abilities:

    1. Mod aboos: Every Day, you may PM the hosts a link to the post of another player who wished for something in bold purple font and grant their wish. That player will have their wish granted and receive a 1-shot ability to use that night.

      The following wish restrictions apply:
      1. They must only wish for items with a 1-shot ability.
      2. They must only wish for 1 item at a time.
      3. They must not wish for a day action.


      The following role restrictions apply:
      1. You may only grant ONE cop check of any type during the game.
      2. You may not grant any Watcher abilities.
      3. You may not grant any Vigilante or Killing abilities.
      4. The game hosts reserve the right to refuse any wish they deem to be overpowered.


    2. peepee poopoo: You may not hint in ANY way or claim your role, or you will lose your abilities. However, you may still post wishes in the game thread.


    MU Anniversary 2022 Game Thread
    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#36261)
    sorry I misclicked I meant to shoot Hallia
    Quote Originally Posted by Aipom (#36337)
    Honestly that's not outing for arete they we not in a spot that was benificial they are still v
    Quote Originally Posted by Aipom (#36352)
    DON'T SHOOT ARETE TALK ABOUT THIS AFTER SHOTS THEY AREN'T OUTED
    Quote Originally Posted by Aipom (#36404)
    Aretes gonna flip town as I've been sawing am back to Vaca ATM will try to come back later
    Quote Originally Posted by Grant (#36418)
    Arete's shot is ultra-suspicious.

    I recommend people NOT hipshot revenge shots on Arete.

    We need to discuss first.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alice Liddell (#36765)
    Would kill JM3/Arete.

    Not too certain on Arete as I can sadly see this $%#! being a misclick except this slot can't be allowed to endgame after today.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alice Liddell (#36800)
    Quote Originally Posted by Ace Marvel (#36781)
    Quote Originally Posted by Alice Liddell (#36765)
    Would kill JM3/Arete.

    Not too certain on Arete as I can sadly see this $%#! being a misclick except this slot can't be allowed to endgame after today.
    Hallia
    Hero
    Hyena
    Inawordyes
    Insaner
    InstantHammer
    JMurder3
    joqiza
    KnightsofCydonia
    Kuti plz
    Lucy
    Lumi
    Manatee
    Marko

    is this misclick range?
    What's the point of them outing like this as a wolf, though?

    It feels like that ideally for W!Arete that they should be playing the long game with their positioning in the thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Parity (#36855)
    ##Vote JMurder3

    Think arete v but their wagon probably not as lousy with wolves as they think
    Quote Originally Posted by NateTheLesser (#36930)
    I just got here but why would w!Arete fake a misclick to go off-list, when they could just... shoot Hallia who they'd know was town?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ty4on (#36996)
    Arete still feels like a miss
    Quote Originally Posted by Parity (#37003)
    To the people saying arete "has to" die for shooting Marko, or that Valentine "has to" die for giving Arctic a life:

    No, they literally don't, you can iso them and decide they are villagers and don't have to die, if you want to.






    Quote Originally Posted by MU Anniversary 2022 (#37577)
    Event Result: Arete has died

    Arete has died. They were a Wolf:


    Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM

    Hello Arete, you are illario.



    Honestly, what is your name!? illario? Happy? We get that everyone can be happy though, it's a good name tbh. You're part of the group of EMers that have recently (or, not that recently anymore) been showing up in most games on the site. A very welcome addition. Your improvement in skill level is by far one of the most significant ones on the site, and you've definitely become a force to be reckoned with... Which maybe isn't that weird since you've played about five hundred mashes, five thousand normal games, and fifty thousand turbos this past year. Your performance in this year's Champs game 7 when you brought your team to a clear win, landing you a first place in the player votes, is a clear an indication of that as any.


    You are a Wolf, and you have the following abilities:

    1. Sacrifices need to be made: Every night, starting n1, you may target another player and submit a list of 5 names, at least one of which must be a wolf. The target will be given this list of 5 names and told that there is at least one wolf in the names. You cannot target the same player on consecutive nights.

    2. As long as the wolves end up winning: If the above ability targets a non-wolf, they will be roleblocked on that night and the following day. Their ITA hit chance will be reduced to 0 on the following day.

    You may now discuss the event and subsequent voting if you wish.


  6. ISO #6
    Responsible for #8 Mistyx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#5)
    katze: wtf, no one with a 35% winrate has any right to say something like that about me. why don't you go back to ToS where you belong, because you definitely don't belong here.
    wow arete community bashing

  7. ISO #7
    Wants It More Arete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mistyx (#6)
    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#5)
    katze: wtf, no one with a 35% winrate has any right to say something like that about me. why don't you go back to ToS where you belong, because you definitely don't belong here.
    wow arete community bashing
    it's actually galaxy-brained bashing of people who think that being from ToS/etc. means you're bad at the game
    Quote Originally Posted by MarkoRaj (#36132)
    Grant is a villager @Celever

    Hardclaim
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafia Host (#36240)
    In-Thread Attack Window

    An In-Thread Attack window has opened. You may use an In-Thread Attack on another player, provided you haven't already used an attack earlier in the Day.

    You can perform this attack by using the following BBCode in a post:

    [ITA]playername[/ITA]

    You can insert it using the ITA BBCode button in the reply menu.

    The contents of the rest of the post are irrelevant, so feel free to flavor it up. Make sure that only the name of the player that you wish to target is inside the BBCode itself.

    After posting, I will quote your post and let you know if your attack succeeded. Good luck!
    The window closes at 1:00 PM EDT on Thursday, July 14th, 2022. There are 1657818060000 remaining.
    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#36251)
    MarkoRaj

    glgl
    Quote Originally Posted by MU Anniversary 2022 (#36346)
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafia Host (#36251)
    Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Day 4 Event

    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#36251)
    MarkoRaj

    glgl
    Hit! MarkoRaj was killed. Stand by for the host to reveal.

    View ITA History

    The window closes at 1:00 PM EDT on Thursday, July 14th, 2022. There are 1657818060000 remaining.
    Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM

    Hello MarkoRaj, you are roro__b.



    Better known as Dobby, you are a part of the lifeblood of this site. You have been involved in the site as a player, moderator, host and walri enthusiast for years. You are perhaps best known for your amazing flavor (who could forget the Congress of Vienna) and childlike sense of humor (peepeepoopoo anyone?). Your dedication to MU and desire to make the site (and every game you are involved with) welcoming to everyone is an inspiration for us all.


    You are a Villager, and you have the following abilities:

    1. Mod aboos: Every Day, you may PM the hosts a link to the post of another player who wished for something in bold purple font and grant their wish. That player will have their wish granted and receive a 1-shot ability to use that night.

      The following wish restrictions apply:
      1. They must only wish for items with a 1-shot ability.
      2. They must only wish for 1 item at a time.
      3. They must not wish for a day action.


      The following role restrictions apply:
      1. You may only grant ONE cop check of any type during the game.
      2. You may not grant any Watcher abilities.
      3. You may not grant any Vigilante or Killing abilities.
      4. The game hosts reserve the right to refuse any wish they deem to be overpowered.


    2. peepee poopoo: You may not hint in ANY way or claim your role, or you will lose your abilities. However, you may still post wishes in the game thread.


    MU Anniversary 2022 Game Thread
    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#36261)
    sorry I misclicked I meant to shoot Hallia
    Quote Originally Posted by Aipom (#36337)
    Honestly that's not outing for arete they we not in a spot that was benificial they are still v
    Quote Originally Posted by Aipom (#36352)
    DON'T SHOOT ARETE TALK ABOUT THIS AFTER SHOTS THEY AREN'T OUTED
    Quote Originally Posted by Aipom (#36404)
    Aretes gonna flip town as I've been sawing am back to Vaca ATM will try to come back later
    Quote Originally Posted by Grant (#36418)
    Arete's shot is ultra-suspicious.

    I recommend people NOT hipshot revenge shots on Arete.

    We need to discuss first.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alice Liddell (#36765)
    Would kill JM3/Arete.

    Not too certain on Arete as I can sadly see this $%#! being a misclick except this slot can't be allowed to endgame after today.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alice Liddell (#36800)
    Quote Originally Posted by Ace Marvel (#36781)
    Quote Originally Posted by Alice Liddell (#36765)
    Would kill JM3/Arete.

    Not too certain on Arete as I can sadly see this $%#! being a misclick except this slot can't be allowed to endgame after today.
    Hallia
    Hero
    Hyena
    Inawordyes
    Insaner
    InstantHammer
    JMurder3
    joqiza
    KnightsofCydonia
    Kuti plz
    Lucy
    Lumi
    Manatee
    Marko

    is this misclick range?
    What's the point of them outing like this as a wolf, though?

    It feels like that ideally for W!Arete that they should be playing the long game with their positioning in the thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Parity (#36855)
    ##Vote JMurder3

    Think arete v but their wagon probably not as lousy with wolves as they think
    Quote Originally Posted by NateTheLesser (#36930)
    I just got here but why would w!Arete fake a misclick to go off-list, when they could just... shoot Hallia who they'd know was town?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ty4on (#36996)
    Arete still feels like a miss
    Quote Originally Posted by Parity (#37003)
    To the people saying arete "has to" die for shooting Marko, or that Valentine "has to" die for giving Arctic a life:

    No, they literally don't, you can iso them and decide they are villagers and don't have to die, if you want to.






    Quote Originally Posted by MU Anniversary 2022 (#37577)
    Event Result: Arete has died

    Arete has died. They were a Wolf:


    Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM

    Hello Arete, you are illario.



    Honestly, what is your name!? illario? Happy? We get that everyone can be happy though, it's a good name tbh. You're part of the group of EMers that have recently (or, not that recently anymore) been showing up in most games on the site. A very welcome addition. Your improvement in skill level is by far one of the most significant ones on the site, and you've definitely become a force to be reckoned with... Which maybe isn't that weird since you've played about five hundred mashes, five thousand normal games, and fifty thousand turbos this past year. Your performance in this year's Champs game 7 when you brought your team to a clear win, landing you a first place in the player votes, is a clear an indication of that as any.


    You are a Wolf, and you have the following abilities:

    1. Sacrifices need to be made: Every night, starting n1, you may target another player and submit a list of 5 names, at least one of which must be a wolf. The target will be given this list of 5 names and told that there is at least one wolf in the names. You cannot target the same player on consecutive nights.

    2. As long as the wolves end up winning: If the above ability targets a non-wolf, they will be roleblocked on that night and the following day. Their ITA hit chance will be reduced to 0 on the following day.

    You may now discuss the event and subsequent voting if you wish.


  8. ISO #8
    Soul Reader Art3mis's Avatar
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    Arete confirmed chatbot
    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Fingerhands (#11258)
    btw manti subbing into his own game and vengefully shooting a player called OwO What's This in revenge for shooting my chatbot is
    amazing

  9. ISO #9
    Wants It More Abraxas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#5)
    2. Many of its arguments ... are bad. "It is important to focus on the current games and not bring in past games" -- this is a fully general argument against meta, which is legal.
    3. it's literally a chatbot, I'm not going to pretend it's not a fun toy but it's also not a magic truth oracle
    2. There is already a precedent to not allow posting of actual meta data from the website here: https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums...ayer-analysis/

    Voting accuracy is one measurement of skill, but you're not allowed to reference anything in the above tool. Why should winrate be treated differently? I can't see a positive of posting someone's winrate in thread.

    3. It's a chatbot with a 10 billion dollar investment from microsoft and overall 30 billion dollar valuation. Hardly a toy.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/qai/202...h=1f833564154a
    There was within me an invincible summer

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    Wants It More Hyena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#5)
    Windward: I think katze is a wolf

    katze: wtf, no one with a 35% winrate has any right to say something like that about me. why don't you go back to ToS where you belong, because you definitely don't belong here.
    lol, I was half-seriously expecting to see a ToSer being the one who was toxic in the example considering the number of times I've seen this, and similar things, happen in our older games, but this ten times as funny -- more so because it's katze. XD
    Quote Originally Posted by Evenstar (#225)
    Hyena's doing some weird $%#!. It's aggressive, it looks scummy as $%#!, it's probably town. Hyena gonna Hyena.

  11. ISO #11
    Season 8 Champze katze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyena (#10)
    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#5)
    Windward: I think katze is a wolf

    katze: wtf, no one with a 35% winrate has any right to say something like that about me. why don't you go back to ToS where you belong, because you definitely don't belong here.
    lol, I was half-seriously expecting to see a ToSer being the one who was toxic in the example considering the number of times I've seen this, and similar things, happen in our older games, but this ten times as funny -- more so because it's katze. XD
    yea but you have a 0% 3p winrate so i dont think u have room to laugh

    β €
    Quote Originally Posted by Arapocalypse (#2181)
    ...meow?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lissa (#10803)
    REVEAL (PART SEVEN)

    In first place and winning the Mafia Championship with 99 points is...







    @katze (Throne of Lies)!
    Quote Originally Posted by Marshal (#174)
    tl;dr: kat called my $%#! small, I townread it
    Quote Originally Posted by katze (#8516)
    Quote Originally Posted by Justplayingitcool (#8515)
    The reality is that when you've soft defended half the wolf team, and tried to kill who I perceive as villagers, it's impossible for me to ever take that slot out of the PoE, or even trust them. I feel like they tried to open the PoE by bringing C4 back into the spotlight.
    hey put respect on my name

    i also hard defended the other half of the wolfteam
    Quote Originally Posted by Hally (#39)
    what if kat is vt

    would she throw like this
    Quote Originally Posted by neopest (#1)
    Today we celebrate the life, career, piety, and knowledge of Katze. The one who exposed the world to this truth and gave meaning to life.

    Quote Originally Posted by katze (#3330)
    Quote Originally Posted by Illwei (#3328)
    you're gonna kill mac I'm just sitting on katze for fun
    😳
    Quote Originally Posted by Illwei (#3353)
    Quote Originally Posted by katze (#3348)
    Quote Originally Posted by Illwei (#3335)
    Quote Originally Posted by Illwei (#3331)
    nah katze no flushed emoji
    you're being too rude at this eod for me to banter with you anymore
    sorry

    i just think ur a wolf

    you can go back to sitting on me
    i'll $%#!in sit on ur mouth $%#!
    Quote Originally Posted by Illwei (#3354)
    not like that not like that not like that

    Quote Originally Posted by Transcend (#217)
    Quote Originally Posted by Transcend (#160)
    Quote Originally Posted by katze (#42)
    ##Vote Sleep

    im tired and feel like staying in bed

    also we don’t have enough info to execute someone d1 or something
    This immediately pings me a bit. Partially because i know it's not smart but also seems like he doesn't wanna step on toes so early.
    Yo katze

    I feel like this might have been a joke post

    But also i feel like there's some truth behind every joke and I just got pinged by this

    So can you tell me the rationale behind this post?
    Quote Originally Posted by Marluxion (#714)
    Katze is uwu
    Quote Originally Posted by illario (#2944)
    Pretty sure Katze is just an innocent memer gamer girl who likes to joke around and play seriously as well and genuinely gets upset when her jokes are taken seriously and her seriousness is taken as jokes

    And if she’s maf then she’s just a borderline sociopath memer girl whose jokes are just lies and her seriousness are just lies and everything about her is a lie and if she flips maf this game and I see her say anything remotely scummy in a future game I’m just gonna death tunnel her to the ends of the earth regardless of how genuine her posts may feel
    Quote Originally Posted by AYAYA (#6543)
    signing my posts makes me feel subhuman

    - chloe
    Quote Originally Posted by Thunal33 (#238)
    you're not a reliable source of redcheck yet
    Quote Originally Posted by nutella
    i looked away for five minutes and katze faked a red?
    Quote Originally Posted by Makaze (#5)
    Why are you doing this?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos (#11644)
    katze how the hell do you have 225 posts in a dead end phase
    Quote Originally Posted by vanity. (#8832)
    ok katze is trolling me lmao

    i feel your pain chloe.
    Quote Originally Posted by neopest (#6889)
    Quote Originally Posted by meowmix (#6885)
    We're dead sure on Lucy being mafia then?
    like 95% the 5% is katze being really awful at setup design
    Quote Originally Posted by neopest (#6928)
    oh jesus christ katze, i hate u
    Quote Originally Posted by SilverKeith (#6932)
    LMAOOOOO

    Ok this is kinda bastard fr

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    spec chat hero iaafr's Avatar
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    I for one agree with the fundamental premise of this thread that Chelsea is toxic

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    Soul Reader Alison's Avatar
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    I think the general concept of using past success/failure as a predictor for future past success/failure isn't inherently wrong - think of how many times you've seen people say something like, "I've always read this person correctly, sheep my read". This isn't that far off from saying you should sheep them because they have an 80% winrate over 30 games, and similarly, "you always tunnel X for bad reasons" isn't that far off from saying you should not listen to the reads of someone with a 25% winrate, on a theoretical level.

    The problem with winrate calculations is that they are very dependent on how the games themselves are run. For instance, some old Syndicate players have winrates of 20% despite playing decently because they used to play in horribly designed games where anyone who died automatically loses the game even if their faction wins. Similarly, if you play in a very insular community where town wins every time because everyone has god meta on each other, then you will have an 80% winrate because you will be town 80% of the time.

    My concern with winrate-invoking isn't that it's toxic, it's that it's inaccurate, and likely to be determined by a variety of different factors, of which skill is only one.
    There's nothing that says a fake can't surpass the real thing.

  14. ISO #14
    Wants It More Arete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alison (#13)
    I think the general concept of using past success/failure as a predictor for future past success/failure isn't inherently wrong - think of how many times you've seen people say something like, "I've always read this person correctly, sheep my read". This isn't that far off from saying you should sheep them because they have an 80% winrate over 30 games, and similarly, "you always tunnel X for bad reasons" isn't that far off from saying you should not listen to the reads of someone with a 25% winrate, on a theoretical level.

    The problem with winrate calculations is that they are very dependent on how the games themselves are run. For instance, some old Syndicate players have winrates of 20% despite playing decently because they used to play in horribly designed games where anyone who died automatically loses the game even if their faction wins. Similarly, if you play in a very insular community where town wins every time because everyone has god meta on each other, then you will have an 80% winrate because you will be town 80% of the time.

    My concern with winrate-invoking isn't that it's toxic, it's that it's inaccurate, and likely to be determined by a variety of different factors, of which skill is only one.
    I think this is a decent argument for it being a bad idea to reason from other players' winrates, but a bad argument for posting other players' winrates being against the rules -- there's no rule against making bad arguments
    Quote Originally Posted by MarkoRaj (#36132)
    Grant is a villager @Celever

    Hardclaim
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafia Host (#36240)
    In-Thread Attack Window

    An In-Thread Attack window has opened. You may use an In-Thread Attack on another player, provided you haven't already used an attack earlier in the Day.

    You can perform this attack by using the following BBCode in a post:

    [ITA]playername[/ITA]

    You can insert it using the ITA BBCode button in the reply menu.

    The contents of the rest of the post are irrelevant, so feel free to flavor it up. Make sure that only the name of the player that you wish to target is inside the BBCode itself.

    After posting, I will quote your post and let you know if your attack succeeded. Good luck!
    The window closes at 1:00 PM EDT on Thursday, July 14th, 2022. There are 1657818060000 remaining.
    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#36251)
    MarkoRaj

    glgl
    Quote Originally Posted by MU Anniversary 2022 (#36346)
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafia Host (#36251)
    Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Day 4 Event

    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#36251)
    MarkoRaj

    glgl
    Hit! MarkoRaj was killed. Stand by for the host to reveal.

    View ITA History

    The window closes at 1:00 PM EDT on Thursday, July 14th, 2022. There are 1657818060000 remaining.
    Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM

    Hello MarkoRaj, you are roro__b.



    Better known as Dobby, you are a part of the lifeblood of this site. You have been involved in the site as a player, moderator, host and walri enthusiast for years. You are perhaps best known for your amazing flavor (who could forget the Congress of Vienna) and childlike sense of humor (peepeepoopoo anyone?). Your dedication to MU and desire to make the site (and every game you are involved with) welcoming to everyone is an inspiration for us all.


    You are a Villager, and you have the following abilities:

    1. Mod aboos: Every Day, you may PM the hosts a link to the post of another player who wished for something in bold purple font and grant their wish. That player will have their wish granted and receive a 1-shot ability to use that night.

      The following wish restrictions apply:
      1. They must only wish for items with a 1-shot ability.
      2. They must only wish for 1 item at a time.
      3. They must not wish for a day action.


      The following role restrictions apply:
      1. You may only grant ONE cop check of any type during the game.
      2. You may not grant any Watcher abilities.
      3. You may not grant any Vigilante or Killing abilities.
      4. The game hosts reserve the right to refuse any wish they deem to be overpowered.


    2. peepee poopoo: You may not hint in ANY way or claim your role, or you will lose your abilities. However, you may still post wishes in the game thread.


    MU Anniversary 2022 Game Thread
    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#36261)
    sorry I misclicked I meant to shoot Hallia
    Quote Originally Posted by Aipom (#36337)
    Honestly that's not outing for arete they we not in a spot that was benificial they are still v
    Quote Originally Posted by Aipom (#36352)
    DON'T SHOOT ARETE TALK ABOUT THIS AFTER SHOTS THEY AREN'T OUTED
    Quote Originally Posted by Aipom (#36404)
    Aretes gonna flip town as I've been sawing am back to Vaca ATM will try to come back later
    Quote Originally Posted by Grant (#36418)
    Arete's shot is ultra-suspicious.

    I recommend people NOT hipshot revenge shots on Arete.

    We need to discuss first.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alice Liddell (#36765)
    Would kill JM3/Arete.

    Not too certain on Arete as I can sadly see this $%#! being a misclick except this slot can't be allowed to endgame after today.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alice Liddell (#36800)
    Quote Originally Posted by Ace Marvel (#36781)
    Quote Originally Posted by Alice Liddell (#36765)
    Would kill JM3/Arete.

    Not too certain on Arete as I can sadly see this $%#! being a misclick except this slot can't be allowed to endgame after today.
    Hallia
    Hero
    Hyena
    Inawordyes
    Insaner
    InstantHammer
    JMurder3
    joqiza
    KnightsofCydonia
    Kuti plz
    Lucy
    Lumi
    Manatee
    Marko

    is this misclick range?
    What's the point of them outing like this as a wolf, though?

    It feels like that ideally for W!Arete that they should be playing the long game with their positioning in the thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Parity (#36855)
    ##Vote JMurder3

    Think arete v but their wagon probably not as lousy with wolves as they think
    Quote Originally Posted by NateTheLesser (#36930)
    I just got here but why would w!Arete fake a misclick to go off-list, when they could just... shoot Hallia who they'd know was town?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ty4on (#36996)
    Arete still feels like a miss
    Quote Originally Posted by Parity (#37003)
    To the people saying arete "has to" die for shooting Marko, or that Valentine "has to" die for giving Arctic a life:

    No, they literally don't, you can iso them and decide they are villagers and don't have to die, if you want to.






    Quote Originally Posted by MU Anniversary 2022 (#37577)
    Event Result: Arete has died

    Arete has died. They were a Wolf:


    Mafia Universe Anniversary 2022 Role PM

    Hello Arete, you are illario.



    Honestly, what is your name!? illario? Happy? We get that everyone can be happy though, it's a good name tbh. You're part of the group of EMers that have recently (or, not that recently anymore) been showing up in most games on the site. A very welcome addition. Your improvement in skill level is by far one of the most significant ones on the site, and you've definitely become a force to be reckoned with... Which maybe isn't that weird since you've played about five hundred mashes, five thousand normal games, and fifty thousand turbos this past year. Your performance in this year's Champs game 7 when you brought your team to a clear win, landing you a first place in the player votes, is a clear an indication of that as any.


    You are a Wolf, and you have the following abilities:

    1. Sacrifices need to be made: Every night, starting n1, you may target another player and submit a list of 5 names, at least one of which must be a wolf. The target will be given this list of 5 names and told that there is at least one wolf in the names. You cannot target the same player on consecutive nights.

    2. As long as the wolves end up winning: If the above ability targets a non-wolf, they will be roleblocked on that night and the following day. Their ITA hit chance will be reduced to 0 on the following day.

    You may now discuss the event and subsequent voting if you wish.


  15. ISO #15
    Too long and too gay lute's Avatar
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    every time I lost was on purpose to avoid people using winrate to read me
    The only verdict is vengeance; a vendetta, held as a votive not in vain, for the value and veracity of such shall one day vindicate the vigilant and the virtuous.
    β™« A thousand eyes open inside β™«
    β™« Grant me sight to see the end β™«
    β™« The more I behold the further I fold β™«
    β™« Into the madness I descend β™«

  16. ISO #16
    Soul Reader Alison's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arete (#14)
    Quote Originally Posted by Alison (#13)
    I think the general concept of using past success/failure as a predictor for future past success/failure isn't inherently wrong - think of how many times you've seen people say something like, "I've always read this person correctly, sheep my read". This isn't that far off from saying you should sheep them because they have an 80% winrate over 30 games, and similarly, "you always tunnel X for bad reasons" isn't that far off from saying you should not listen to the reads of someone with a 25% winrate, on a theoretical level.

    The problem with winrate calculations is that they are very dependent on how the games themselves are run. For instance, some old Syndicate players have winrates of 20% despite playing decently because they used to play in horribly designed games where anyone who died automatically loses the game even if their faction wins. Similarly, if you play in a very insular community where town wins every time because everyone has god meta on each other, then you will have an 80% winrate because you will be town 80% of the time.

    My concern with winrate-invoking isn't that it's toxic, it's that it's inaccurate, and likely to be determined by a variety of different factors, of which skill is only one.
    I think this is a decent argument for it being a bad idea to reason from other players' winrates, but a bad argument for posting other players' winrates being against the rules -- there's no rule against making bad arguments
    Yeah I think it should be allowed under the rules but also I want everyone to know that it's a bad argument and nobody should ever listen to it.
    There's nothing that says a fake can't surpass the real thing.

  17. ISO #17
    Galaxy Brain Twice Shrunk's Avatar
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    tfw you realize this isn't a joke
    Quote Originally Posted by Twice Shrunk (#2684)
    as noted by dvc getting modkilled was optimal play at some point and I am just ahead of my times

  18. ISO #18
    pfft pfft pfft moth's Avatar
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    A team with moth is a fun team. And it usually wins. like 40% of the time

  19. ISO #19
    Wants It More Variance's Avatar
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    i only respect 0% winrate players

  20. ISO #20
    Wants It More SheepButBad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxas (#1)
    Here are chatGPT's thoughts on the matter:
    "unbiased bot opinion"

    anyhow my thoughts on the matter are mostly just that winrate isn't indicative of a player's skill level most of the time & shouldn't be used or seen as an actual point.

    In the specific example I think it's less that you were being discussed as much as your play.

    I also think that players should be able to take the player who is pushing somebody into account when considering a read.

    Just invoking a winrate is not toxic within itself tbh so that should be that?

  21. ISO #21
    GOAT Tier matt's Avatar
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    This is such a good troll thread lmao

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Role of the Day
Unlyncher

The Uneliminator is an independently aligned player whose win condition is to ensure that a specific player is not eliminated for the entire duration of the game.